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Mumia Abu-Jamal Moved from Prison to Intensive Care, Supporters Seek Access and Answers
Imprisoned journalist and former Black Panther Mumia Abu-Jamal has been taken to the Intensive Care Unit of Schuylkill Medical Center in Pottsville, Pennsylvania, after he was removed from prison for a medical emergency without any notification to his family, friends or lawyers. Prison officials told his supporters he is in diabetic shock. We get an update from Abu-Jamal’s longtime friend, Johanna Fernández who first discovered he was in the hospital Monday morning when she went to visit him in prison and was told he had been taken to the intensive care unit. Fernández is a history professor at Baruch College-CUNY, and one of the coordinators of the Campaign to Bring Mumia Home.
TRANSCRIPT
This is a rush transcript. Copy may not be in its final form.
AARON MATÉ: We end today’s show with news of imprisoned journalist and former Black Panther Mumia Abu-Jamal has been taken to the Intensive Care Unit of his prison hospital in Pottsville, Pennsylvania, after he was removed from prison for a medical emergency without any notification to his family, friends or lawyers.
AMY GOODMAN: For more are joined by by Mumia Abu-Jamal’s longtime friend Johanna Fernández, who first discovered he was in the hospital on Monday when she went to visit him in prison and was told he had been taken to the intensive care unit at Schuylkill Medical Center in Pottsville, Pennsylvania. Welcome back to Democracy Now! We only have a few minutes, but, What do you understand has happened to Mumia Abu-Jamal?
JOHANNA FERNÁNDEZ: Well, Mumia has had a longstanding situation. Over the last three months he developed severe eczema outbreak. He describes his skin as akin to that of an elephant’s, it’s been raw, bleeding. He was in the infirmary for approximately a week within the hospital, approximately a month ago. So, that means that he has been undergoing medical examinations, or least we have been told. Yesterday, he underwent a diabetic shock.
AMY GOODMAN: How do you know this?
JOHANNA FERNÁNDEZ: Because the prison informed his wife, Wadiya Jamal. When we arrived at the prison, were informed that we could not visit him and pressured the prison to tell us what was going on. They finally said he, well, he’s been hospitalized but would not release information.
AMY GOODMAN: Not in a prison hospital, but in a local hospital.
JOHANNA FERNÁNDEZ: Not in a prison hospital, but in a local hospital, Schuylkill Medical Center in Pottsville, Pennsylvania. So, right now, Mumia is sequestered. He hasn’t been seen by any of his attorneys or supporters or next of kin.
AMY GOODMAN: His brother, Kevin Cook?
JOHANNA FERNÁNDEZ: His brother was there —
AMY GOODMAN: Keith Cook.
JOHANNA FERNÁNDEZ: — Keith Cook, for the past 20 hours. Pam Africa, Ramona Africa, they all drove there from Harrisburg, where the case of the silencing act was being heard before the third circuit court. Immediately, after that ended, they rushed up to Pottsville, and the doctors will not speak to us. They will not release any information to the family. Meanwhile, Mumia is shackled, probably, to a bed. There are four guards, a phalanx of guards guarding him, and keeping us from the room, 10 feet away. We were able to see that he was behind this room.
AMY GOODMAN: What do you feel needs to happen?
JOHANNA FERNÁNDEZ: We need to defend Mumia’s life immediately. He is in enemy territory right now, and we need people to call the hospital, Schuylkill Medical Center in Pottsville, Pennsylvania. We need people to call the prison and demand that he be seen by outside doctors to really assess the situation.
AMY GOODMAN: Johanna, we have to leave it there. I thank you for being with us, Johanna Fernández, Professor of History at Baruch College CUNY, one of the coordinators of the campaign to Bring Mumia Home, it’s called. That does it for the show. A very happy birthday to our own Mike Burke!
"Straights Only"? Indiana Faces Boycotts, Protests over Anti-LGBT "Religious Freedom" Law
Indiana is facing boycotts and fierce criticism following Gov. Mike Pence’s new measure that could sanction discrimination by allowing business owners to refuse service to LGBT customers in the name of "religious freedom." Connecticut is the first state to officially boycott Indiana over the move, now San Francisco and Seattle have also imposed bans on city-funded travel to the state. Nine chief executive officers, including the heads of Angie’s List and Eli Lilly, wrote letters asking Indiana state officials to "take immediate action" to ensure the act will not sanction or encourage discrimination. On Saturday, thousands of people marched in Indianapolis calling for Pence’s resignation. Critics have called for a boycott, and some, including former NBA star Charles Barkley, are calling for the upcoming Final Four college basketball championship, to be moved out of state. Supporters of the legislation have said 19 other states have similar laws and that Indiana is attracting undue criticism. Pence has said he will seek a new measure to "clarify the intent" of his new law, though he added that LGBT protections are "not on my agenda." We are joined by Eunice Rho, advocacy and policy counsel for the American Civil Liberties Union.
TRANSCRIPT
This is a rush transcript. Copy may not be in its final form.
AARON MATÉ: Indiana has come under fierce criticism after Governor Mike Pence signed into law a new Religious Freedom Restoration Act that could sanction anti-LGBT discrimination, it could allow business owners to refuse service to lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender customers in the name of religious freedom. The move has drawn widespread outrage with Connecticut becoming the first state to officially boycott Indiana over the move, followed by Washington State, San Francisco and Seattle. They have also imposed bans on city-funded travel to the state. Nine chief executive officers, including the heads of Angie’s List and Eli Lilly, wrote letters asking Indiana state officials to take immediate action to ensure the act will not sanction or encourage discrimination. Tim Cook, CEO of Apple, the world’s most profitable company, slammed Indiana’s law and others like it, likening it to the Jim Crow laws of the American South. Cook wrote, in the The Washington Post that Apple would oppose the measure, saying, "The days of segregation and discrimination marked by 'Whites Only' signs on shop doors, water fountains and restrooms must remain deep in our past. We must never return to any semblance of that time. America must be a land of opportunity for everyone."
AMY GOODMAN: On Saturday, thousands marched in Indianapolis calling for Governor Pence’s resignation. And former NBA star Charles Barkley, is calling for the upcoming Final Four college basketball championship games to be moved out of state. Speaking to ABC News, Pence refused to answer whether it will be illegal to discriminate against LGBT people.
GOV. MICHAEL PENCE: This is not about discrimination, this is about empowering to confront government overreach, George.
GEORGE STEPHANOPOULOS: Let me try to pin you down — let me try to pin you down here on it, because your supporters say it would. And so, yes or no, if a florist in Indiana refuses to serve a gay couple at their wedding, is that legal now in Indiana?
GOV. MICHAEL PENCE: George, this is where this debate has gone with misinformation, and frankly —
GEORGE STEPHANOPOULOS: It’s just a question. Yes or no?
GOV. MICHAEL PENCE: Well, well, there’s been shameless rhetoric about my state and about this law and about its intention all over the internet. People are trying to make it about one particular issue, and now you’re doing that as well.
AMY GOODMAN: That’s ABC 's George Stephanopoulos questioning Governor Pence who says he'll now seek a new measure to clarify the intent of his new law, though, he noted LGBT protections are, "not on my agenda." For more, we are joined by Eunice Rho, advocacy and policy counsel for the American Civil Liberties Union. Welcome to Democracy Now! Talk about the significance of this so-called Religious Freedom Law.
EUNICE RHO: Thank you for having me. So, Indiana is now the 20th state to pass the Religious Freedom Restoration Act, but, it is different from where this debate originally began. As you may remember, in 1993, there was a federal law that passed Congress following a Native American who smoked peyote as part of his religious ritual and then was dismissed from his job and then denied unemployment benefits. He challenged that decision as a burden on his religious beliefs and the Supreme Court ruled against the Native American religious believer. So, in response to that, Congress enacted the federal Religious Freedom Restoration Act.
AMY GOODMAN: This was under President Clinton, he signed off on it.
EUNICE RHO: This was under President Clinton, yes —
AMY GOODMAN: And is what Pence keeps citing, we’re not doing anything different that Clinton did or 20 other states.
EUNICE RHO: Right, and I have to be very honest and say the ACLU was part of that very broad and very diverse coalition. Fast-forward to 2015, we’re in a completely different context. This law, the Religious Freedom and Restoration Act in Indiana was introduced last year once the legislature failed to pass a ban on same-sex marriage. They followed it up in 2015 because they didn’t pass it last year, and this time around, the legislators swore up and down, the leadership said we are not intending for this law to be used to discriminate, and so we said great. We support religious freedom, we don’t want it to be used to discriminate either. Let’s clarify this, let’s put it in the bill, and every single one of those amendments was voted down by the legislature that swore to us that they did not want this to be used to discriminate. And then, at the signing ceremony that Governor Pence held, he had two representative from organizations that are widely known in the state of Indiana to be very anti-gay, and, in fact, justify their support of the Indiana Religious Freedom Restoration Act, justify their support, by saying that it can be used and it will be used to discriminate against LGBT people. So, I think all of Governor Pence’s declaration, unfortunately, are refuted by the evidence to the contrary.
AARON MATÉ: What exactly could this law do? And what about the argument that Amy mentioned, which is that Pence says that 20 other states have this on the books?
EUNICE RHO: Sure, so, again, the context in Indiana being so different, and in terms of what the law can do, it allows anyone to voice a religious objection to any law or policy on the books and would require the court to resolve that dispute, but, the test that the court has to apply is very stringent and it is difficult for the defending party because they have to show whatever policy that is being challenged furthers a compelling governmental interest, and applying that policy to the person who is trying to challenge it is the only way of achieving that interest.
AMY GOODMAN: I want to talk about that picture you referred to of the private signing ceremony, the single graphic, writes GLAAD — that’s the group against gay and lesbian discrimination — one simple graphic, they say, shows the anti-LGBT animus behind Indiana’s law. They say that among those who were at this private signing ceremony were Micah Clark, Curt Smith, and Eric Miller, and then they cited what some of them have said; Kurt Smith equating homosexuality with bestiality and adultery, Eric Miller saying pedophilia is a sexual orientation on par with homosexuality. These are the men who are standing right next to Governor Pence in this private ceremony signing the bill.
EUNICE RHO: It is incredibly unfortunate that these are the people that he chose to represent in the photo that the governor’s office issued after its private signing ceremony. But, I would like to point out, there is now a vigorous effort to try to mitigate the damage that has been done to Indiana both economically and just reputationaly. There is an effort to update the existing state civil rights laws to include protections for LGBT people, and to update the Religious Freedom Restoration Act that has just been passed, as well, to be sure that it cannot be used to discriminate, and this is an ongoing effort. The Indiana legislature has a month left in its session. I think the governor and the legislature have a real opportunity to fix this problem and ensure that Indiana is again open for everybody.
AMY GOODMAN: Is Arkansas next?
EUNICE RHO: Yes, the Religious Freedom Restoration Act in Arkansas has passed the legislature, it is headed to the governor’s office.
AMY GOODMAN: The governor says he will sign. We will see what will happens with — I mean, it’s not just the people that Governor Pence expected to be opposed to this. He has got the largest corporations in his state, he’s got the NCAA, he’s got major boycotts being announced by other states not sending workers, state employees from Connecticut on the public dime, to Indiana.
EUNICE RHO: You know, I think we have been incredibly heartened, I think we all have been, by the public outcry, especially from the business community. I think this really signals a widespread understanding that LGBT equality is an American value that we should all uphold. And I’m especially encouraged by the fact that the CEOs were not just sending statements of support, but actually putting their money where their mouths are.
AARON MATÉ: And it signals that corporations have a lot of influence and power over politics and policy decisions.
EUNICE RHO: Absolutely, and I think that other states that are contemplating similar laws like Arkansas or North Carolina or Nevada and elsewhere, really need to pay attention to Indiana, and their legislators and governors in those states should understand that this is not only what the public wants, but it’s also not what is sound for their state economies.
AMY GOODMAN: Would it be solved by simply making LGBT people protected, that they can’t be discriminated against, or does it simply need to be revoked, and should that happen in other states? Should the federal religious freedom law simply be overturned?
EUNICE RHO: I think one of the most encouraging parts of the dialogue is it is encouraging the re-examination of not only the Indiana law, but existing laws in other states. In states that have LGBT protection statewide, they should consider updating their Religious Freedom Restoration Acts to make it crystal clear to the courts that their civil rights laws are not up to debate. These laws should not at all be used to discriminate or harm against their state’s citizens.
AMY GOODMAN: We want to thank you, Eunice Rho for joining us. Advocacy and policy counsel for the American Civil Liberties Union. She works with ALCU offices across the country in their lobbying and advocacy work on laws pertaining to religious freedom. And of course, we will continue what’s happening in Indiana and across the states around this country.
"A Matter of War & Peace": Iran, Powers Near Preliminary Deal in face of Congress-Israel Opposition
Negotiators meeting in Lausanne, Switzerland, over an Iran nuclear deal are set to issue a general statement that enough progress has been made to continue in a new phase aimed at a comprehensive agreement in June. Details of the talks have been kept under wraps. The United States had imposed a Tuesday deadline for a preliminary accord in order to help stave off congressional opposition, buoyed by the efforts of Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu. Congress has vowed to impose additional sanctions if negotiators fail to reach a preliminary agreement, and the Senate is expected to take up a measure that would give Congress final approval. We go to Lausanne for an update from Trita Parsi, founder and president of the National Iranian American Council, who has been following the negotiations closely.
TRANSCRIPT
This is a rush transcript. Copy may not be in its final form.
AARON MATÉ: We begin today’s show in Lausanne, Switzerland, where six days of historic talks over an Iran nuclear deal have reportedly closed. The Associated Press says negotiators will issue a general statement that enough progress has been made to continue in a new phase aimed at a comprehensive agreement in June. Russian Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov said U.N. sanctions against Iran should be lifted if a nuclear deal is reached.
MINISTER SERGEI LAVROV: I think sanctions should be suspended after the agreements are reached. They should be lifted. There are different ways; to lift them completely or first suspend them temporarily and lift them legally afterwards. But, in practice, it should mean that sanctions should be lifted, and should not interfere with legal trade and economic activity between Iran and its foreign partners.
AMY GOODMAN: Meanwhile, Congress has vowed to impose additional sanctions if negotiators fail to reach a preliminary deal. Well, for more we go to Lausanne, Switzerland, where we are joined by Trita Parsi, Founder and President of the National Iranian American Council. He has been following the negotiations closely there. His book is a "A Single Roll of the Dice: Obama’s Diplomacy with Iran." Welcome back to Democracy Now! Can you talk about the agreement that has been worked out, Trita, just now?
TRITA PARSI: Frankly, no one can, because the details have not been released. All we know is that AP reports that there’s going to be a statement about an understanding, and the reason for that is that the Iranians refuse to agree to two-phase agreement because of bad experience with doing that in 2009. But, if it, in reality is, a political framework, or just a mere understanding, will be revealed once we have the details which is scheduled to be released today.
AARON MATÉ: Trita, what was Iran’s bad experience, that you mentioned, and what are you looking for to happen next?
TRITA PARSI: Well, in 2009, on October 1, in Geneva, for the first time, the Iranians and the Americans sat down during the first year of President Obama’s term, and they discussed the principles of a swap deal. The Iranians agreed, in principle, to a swap deal and then later on, around October 20, they had a conversation about the details. At that stage, it turned out that the two sides actually had irreconcilable differences when it comes to the details. The narrative that came out of that then was that the Iranians had first agreed, and then backtracked. And it was very easy for the West to put the blame on the Iranians, which then later on became a critical component towards imposing new sanctions on Iran. That’s exactly what the Iranians are trying to avoid here. They do not want to agree to anything that is unclear at this point, and then later on when additional negotiations are taking place, find out that there is a disagreement, and then, then they get the blame for it.
AMY GOODMAN: Can you talk about the significance of putting this off? I mean, what does it mean to say it’s a self-imposed deadline, and what you see as the major sticking point?
TRITA PARSI: Well, I think it is important to keep in mind that this deadline of March 31, in reality is primarily an American deadline, because of the pressure that Congress has been putting on the president of the United States. The other actors, primarily look at June 30 as the real deadline, mindful of the fact that the interim agreement is valid for another three months. They could have walked away with nothing, and the interim agreement would still be in place. So, what that means then is that the way that Congress has been putting pressure on the U.S. team has not worked in such a way that the Iranians are pressured. Rather, the pressure is truly on the American side, and is adding time pressure on the Americans in a way that the others are not feeling. But, nevertheless, it seems they are going to be able to walk away with something that would enable the U.S. team to come back and resist the pressures from Congress. The next step then would be to continue the negotiations and work out a real framework, a real final deal with a deadline of June 30.
AARON MATÉ: You mentioned the obstacles — or the potential obstacles from Congress. There is a measure from Senator Bob Corker that’s going to come up next month that would give Congress the ability to kill the deal, basically. Do you see that as a significant factor here — can Congress stop whatever deal would be reached?
TRITA PARSI: Yeah, on April 14, it is scheduled to be marked up in the Senate. This is what is called an oversight bill, but in reality it contains measures that is more of an interference in the negotiations than mere oversight. For instance, the president does not have his suspension rights for sanctions for the first 60 days after a deal is struck in order for the Senate to review the deal. That is actually a direct interference because what the two sides are negotiating about right now is precisely the schedule of sanctions relief. And if they come to a conclusion on that, and then the Senate says, no, hold on, we are withdrawing your suspension rights for 60 days, that is direct interference can cause the blame of the collapse of talks to fall on the U.S. side.
AMY GOODMAN: What has surprised you the most, Trita Parsi? You are a very close follower of relations between U.S. and Iran, and of course, other countries are involved with this as well; Russia, the foreign minister is just returning.
TRITA PARSI: Well, I think there is something absolutely unique and historic going on here. The P5+1 have their own severe disagreements and actually conflicts, particularly between the U.S. and Russia right now, and the EU and Russia. Yet, on this issue, they have managed to keep a tremendous professional unity towards getting some form of an agreement on the nuclear issue. And it shows the importance of finding this agreement because this truly is a matter of war and peace. And that, I think, casts the opponents in the Senate, or in Israel, or elsewhere, as even more isolated because, frankly, the entire P5+1 is united towards trying to get the same deal that the president of the United States is pursuing.
AMY GOODMAN: Trita Parsi, right now, the Speaker of the House of Representatives, John Boehner, has taken a delegation to meet with Netanyahu in Israel. In Lausanne, Josh Block, who is a former American Israel Public Affairs Committee AIPAC spokesperson, is — has the Israel Project. What pressure has Israel brought to bear here? Do you think Netanyahu is succeeding in scuttling the talks?
TRITA PARSI: The Israelis have put on an enormous amount of pressure from the very first minute that President Obama came into office and declared that he wanted to pursue diplomacy, but I would, frankly, say that the Israelis have less influence right now than they could have had had they played their cards differently. The very, very aggressive tone of Prime Minister Netanyahu, this very clear cut attempt to try to sabotage the talks, has actually pushed Netanyahu further to the margins, and has given him less opportunities to be able to sabotage it. But, make no mistake, the Israelis are very much against the steel and are trying to do everything they can do to stop it, but there is an air of inevitability, right here in Lausanne, that something is going to come out of these talks.
AMY GOODMAN: Trita Parsi, we want to thank you for being with us; Founder and President of the National Iranian American Council. His book is a "A Single Roll of the Dice: Obama’s Diplomacy with Iran." He’s speaking to us from Lausanne, Switzerland, where the Iran negotiations are taking place. When we come back, we go to Florida where we will be joined by former Senator George Mitchell, who is the former envoy under President Obama to the Middle East. We will talk about Iran and Israel. Stay with us.
Former Mideast Peace Envoy George Mitchell on U.S.-Israel Showdown over Iran, Palestinian Statehood
George Mitchell, the former senator and U.S. Special Envoy for Middle East Peace under President Obama, joins us to discuss the escalating U.S.-Israel standoff over Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu’s campaign against an Iran nuclear deal and open rejection of the two-state solution. Last week, it emerged Israeli intelligence spied on the Iran talks and then fed the information to congressional Republicans. Obama and other top officials have vowed to re-evaluate their approach to the Israel-Palestine conflict following Netanyahu’s vow to prevent a Palestinian state. U.S. officials have suggested they might take steps, including no longer vetoing U.N. Security Council resolutions critical of Israel. A first test of the new U.S. approach might come in the next few weeks when France will put forward a U.N. Security Council measure aimed at encouraging peace talks between Israel and the Palestinian Authority. Mitchell headed the U.S. role in the Mideast talks between 2009 and 2011. He previously served under President Bill Clinton, as the Special Envoy for Northern Ireland, where he helped broker the Belfast Peace Agreement of 1998.
TRANSCRIPT
This is a rush transcript. Copy may not be in its final form.
AARON MATÉ: As historic talks over an Iran nuclear deal have reportedly closed ahead of the U.S. imposed deadline, the Israeli government continues to oppose a deal. Last week, it emerged that Israelis intelligence spied on the Iran talks, and then fed the information to congressional Republicans. Now, Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu says the deal’s proposed terms are even worse than he thought. Speaking on Sunday, Netanyahu appeared to invoke the "axis of evil" moniker used by president George W. Bush for Iran, Iraq and North Korea. But, Netanyahu But, Netanyahu offered a new variation on the axis members.
PRIME MINISTER NETANYAHU: [translated] I expressed out deep concern towards this deal emerging with Iran nuclear talks. This deal, as it appears to be merging, bears out all of our fears, and even more than that. The Iran-Lausanne-Yemen axis is very dangerous to humanity, and this must be stopped.
AARON MATÉ: The Lausanne, in that axis, refers to the Swiss town where the nuclear talks are taking place. That apparently puts the U.S. inside of the axis that Netanyahu opposes, along with the five other world powers negotiating with Iran.
AMY GOODMAN: Netanyahu’s comment was the latest in an escalating standoff with the White House over Mideast policy. President Obama and other top officials have vowed to re-evaluate their approach to the Israel-Palestine conflict following Netanyahu’s open rejection of a two-state solution. U.S. officials have suggested they might take steps including no longer vetoing U.N. Security Council resolutions critical of Israel. Some predict a major shift in U.S. policy. A headline in The Washington Post describes it as, "Obama’s Next Earthquake." And the first test of the new U.S. approach might come in the next few weeks. France will put forward a U.N. Security Council measure aimed at encouraging peace talks between Israel and the Palestinian Authority. The measure would include parameters for negotiations, presumably based on an Israeli withdrawal from the Occupied Territories and the establishment of a Palestinian state there.
For more we go to a guest who has been deeply involved in U.S. efforts to seek a peace deal between Israel and Palestine. Senator George Mitchell served as U.S. Special Envoy for Middle East Peace under President Obama from 2009 to 2011. He previously served under President Bill Clinton, as the Special Envoy for Northern Ireland, where he helped broker the Belfast Peace Agreement of 1998. Before that, Senator Mitchell served as Democratic Senator from Maine for 15 years, including as Senate Majority Leader from 1989 to 1995. Welcome to Democracy Now! Let us start on this issue of proposed measures President Obama and the administration is considering possibly against Israel, particularly what might happen in the United Nations.
SEN. GEORGE MITCHELL: Well, I don’t think it is possible to know. I doubt very much that any decision finally has been made within the White House. I think it’s all under review, as the president has said. It will depend, obviously, in part on the circumstances that exist at the time any such resolution is introduced in the United Nations, what the language of the resolution is, what the reaction both within the United States and among our allies. I do think think that the president is appropriately reviewing our policies given the developments of the past few weeks, particularly the various statements of Prime Minister Netanyahu. But, I don’t think anyone should draw any final conclusion from the discussions that are now underway, particularly since we do not yet know what is going to happen with the talks with Iran, which is obviously major factor.
AARON MATÉ: Senator Mitchell, can we agree that this would be a major shift if the U.S. starts supporting or not blocking critical measures at the U.N.? I want to go first to a clip from U.N. Ambassador Samantha Power. Speaking about a year ago, she said the U.S. will continue to block Palestinian efforts in forums like the U.N.
AMBASSADOR SAMANTHA POWER: There are no shortcuts to statehood, and we have made that clear. Efforts that attempt to circumvent the peace process, the hard slog of the peace process, are only counterproductive to the peace process itself and to the ultimate objective of securing statehood, the objective that the Palestinian Authority, of course, has. So, we have contested every effort, even prior to the restart of negotiations spearheaded by Secretary Kerry. Every time the Palestinians have sought to make a move on a U.N. agency, a treaty, etc., we have opposed it.
AARON MATÉ: Power went on to say that trying to deter Palestinian action is what we do all the time and what we will continue to do. Now, that was a year ago. Now things are different, Senator Mitchell. Can you talk about why the U.S. was previously blocking resolutions such as simply criticizing the expansion of Israeli settlements in the occupied territories?
SEN. GEORGE MITCHELL: It has been, for many decades, under presidents of both parties, U.S. policy that the differences between the Israelis and Palestinians should be resolved in the direct negotiations between the parties with the support and assistance of the U.S. and other allies. And as a necessary corollary to that, U.S. policy has been that the issues should not be resolved outside of direct negotiations. And so, unilateral action by either side to bring about a change that would alter the circumstances on the ground, or that would resolve an issue unilaterally that should be resolved in negotiations were to be resisted. That is why the United States has consistently, publicly opposed Israel’s policies and actions regarding settlements, even as it has opposed, publicly, Palestinian efforts to resolve other issues outside of direct negotiations. So, American policy has been clearly consistent.
What is different now, of course, is that is all premised on the basis that there will be a direct negotiation between Israelis and Palestinians to achieve the goals that each seeks; security for Israel and its people, and a state for the Palestinian people. The reason that circumstances have changed now, is that Prime Minister Netanyahu, on the day before his election, said that there would not be a Palestinian state while he was Prime Minister. That, effectively, undermined the principle of American policy, of what our objectives would be. The next day, he appeared to walk back from that, and so there is now some question about policy in that regard, and I think that is what has led to the review that you described earlier.
AMY GOODMAN: I want to turn to William Quandt, who served on the National Security Council under Presidents Carter and Nixon. At a recent event, he suggested the U.S. needs to impose a cost on Israel for maintaining the occupation.
WILLIAM QUANDT: What doesn’t work is just saying you know what needs to be done, but, there are no consequences if you don’t do it, and that is what we have done in the past. We used language that, if I were to try to translate it, I wouldn’t know what to say. We say, the illegitimacy of continued settlement activity, but, we don’t say that the settlements are illegal.
AMY GOODMAN: So, that’s a William Quandt, a former National Security Council official, saying the status quo simply doesn’t work. Your response to this, Senator George Mitchell, and also, if you could respond to the other controversy statement, to say the least, of what Netanyahu said on the day of the elections, concerned about the Arab of vote that was turning out.
SEN. GEORGE MITCHELL: Well, he has apologized for that, and so, I think that is a separate issue from the first one that you described. The fact is, of course, that both sides have, for a very long time, urged that the United States impose consequences on the other side. Both regard that as the way to resolve the issue. Palestinians and many Arabs repeatedly told me in meetings that the way to get this issue solved is for the United States to cut off all aid to Israel. They are dependant on you, they said, and if you cut off all aid, they will do what you want. The Israelis, on the other hand, make the exactly the same statement regarding aid to the Palestinians. They’re dependent on you, they told me, and if you will just cut off all aid to the Palestinians, they will do what you want. In my judgment, neither of those options is viable or would work. Israel is a democracy — a vibrant democracy. They are a proud and sovereign people. And taking punitive action, I think, would be first, inappropriate, because of our close relationship to them, and secondly, I think it would be counterproductive. I do not think it would produce the desired result. It would further isolate the relations — further separate the relations between the parties, and reduce American influence there, and I don’t think that is helpful in what we want is the objective of a peace agreement between Israel and Palestinians, and equally important, normalization of relations between Israel and its Arab neighbors, most of whom are also allies with the United States, and who, paradoxically, and somewhat ironically, are aligned with Israel on the issue of Iran and nuclear weapons.
There is no stronger supporter of the position that Prime Minister Netanyahu is taking on the Iran nuclear deal than the government of Saudi Arabia, for example, which disagrees with Israel on other issues. So, it’s complicated, it’s difficult. There is a powerful temptation to resort to — well, if we just do this, they will do that, and if we take this action, they will take that action. I don’t think that is the case. I think, ultimately, there has to be there has to be a discussion between the parties with the strong support to achieve the mutually beneficial objectives. Israel has a state. They don’t have security. They want it, and they deserve it. The Palestinians don’t have a state. They want one, and they deserve one. Israel is not going to get security until the Palestinians get a state, and the Palestinians are not going to get a state until the people of Israel have a reasonable and sustainable degree of security. It is in their mutually beneficial interest to reach agreement, and I think over time, that is going to become clear to the public on both sides, as well as important not to leave out of the discussion of the following that, the normalization of relations between Israel and its neighbors, it’s Gulf Arab neighbors in the region, which would be beneficial to all concerned.
AARON MATÉ: But, Senator, if we’re talking about taking punitive measures, can we agree that the two parties are not equal? They’re not occupying each other. It’s Israel that has been occupying the Palestinians for nearly 50 years. They have nuclear weapons, they are a huge power. Even during the so-called peace process, the settlements have expanded massively. So, Palestinians can say, well, look, the status quo of 50 years simply has not worked. Israel — the U.S., Israel’s largest supporter, has to change it’s policy decisively.
SEN. GEORGE MITCHELL: Well, it is true, that the parties are not equal, of course, and one reason for having outside participation in the process is to provide an independent interlocutor, someone who would assist the parties in reaching an agreement, and despite the criticism of the United States by many, there is, in fact, no other entity in the world that can perform that task other than the United States government. No other entity can create the circumstances, the conditions, the follow up that is necessary for these agreements. And so, we do have an important role to play. We can play it. We are, and will continue to be close friends, allies, and supporters of the people of Israel. That does not mean that we agree with the government of Israel on every issue, and surely, the disagreements between the U.S. and Israel in recent weeks have been very well documented and displayed for all of the world to see.
At the same time, we support a Palestinian state. President George W. Bush set that out very persuasively and comprehensively in several speeches, including one he made in Jerusalem in January, 2009. So, I think that the United States can and must play a central role in bringing about an agreement, and most importantly seeing that an agreement is a adhered to over over time, and I think that is the role we are going to play. I think they will come around to it on both sides. I don’t think that we should say it is somehow our role to take punitive action against Israel so as to try to equal the status between them and the Palestinians. That would not work, and I do not think it would achieve the desired objective.
AMY GOODMAN: Ahead of a trip to Israel this week, House Speaker John Boehner called President Obama’s recent criticism of Netanyahu reprehensible. Speaking to CNN, the house speaker also suggested it’s the fault of the Obama administration that Netanyahu has rejected Palestinian statehood.
SPEAKER JOHN BOEHNER: I think the animosity exhibited by our administration toward the prime minister of Israel is reprehensible. And I think that the pressure that they have put on him over the last four or five years has, frankly, pushed him to the point where he had to speak up. I don’t blame him at all for speaking up.
AMY GOODMAN: I would like you to respond to the house speaker, the Republican leadership siding with Netanyahu, a foreign Prime Minister, over President Obama.
SEN. GEORGE MITCHELL: Well, I don’t agree with Speaker Boehner on either of the points that he made. Of course, there is a long history, in the United States, which is an open, vibrant democracy, of people disagreeing with the president. That is what is essential to democracy, that the absence of support for government policies at any given time is not evidence of a lack of patriotism. It’s essential to our free system. On the particular issues that Speaker Boehner has just described, while I fully respect his right to express his view, I respectfully, but strongly disagree with the conclusions that he reached, that somehow it is President Obama’s fault that Prime Minister Netanyahu has made differing statements with respect to a Palestinian state.
AARON MATÉ: And Senator, should peace talks ever resume, what do you see as the major sticking points that might prove to be an obstacle to talks, and do you have any ideas for what solutions could be introduced?
SEN. GEORGE MITCHELL: Well, all of the issues are sticking points. There are no easy issues in the Palestinian-Israeli dispute. They are all important. Where the borders would be. The distribution and rights with respect to water, which is a crucial issue in that region of the world, and, of course, in other parts of the world. The status of the right of return of the Palestinians. The issue of Jerusalem — whether it should be the capital of both countries, or not. So, you have a whole range of very, very difficult issues, but in my judgment, all of which can be resolved, if there is a basis of trust between the two parties. This discussion has been long and complicated, but it hasn’t mentioned what, in my judgment, is the single most important issue, and it is the high level of mistrust between both societies and both leaders. Having had long experience in the region, having met many, many times with Prime Minister Netanyahu and his predecessors, and President Abbas and his predecessor, I think that is the single most difficult issue.
Prime Minister Netanyahu, in my opinion, does not believe that President Abbas has either the will or the capacity, personal or political strength, to reach agreement, and push one through to approval and implementation. President Abbass, on the other hand, does not believe that Prime Minister Netanyahu is serious about getting an agreement. When Prime Minister Netanyahu announced in June of 2009 that he favored a two-state solution, no Palestinians believed that he was telling the truth, and neither did any of the Arabs. They thought he was saying that just to accommodate the pressure from the United States. As Speaker Boehner has suggested, this is really the reverse side of that argument.
So, when Prime Minister Netanyahu, on the day before the recent election, said there wouldn’t be a state, all of the Arabs reacted with, I told you so. We didn’t believe him in the first place. And then, of course, when he appeared to walk back from that on the following day, that just furthered the impression of mistrust on the part of the Palestinians and the Arabs. So, at the root cause of this, is that you have two leaders who do not believe that the other has the intent, sincerity, or capability to reach an agreement, and are therefore reluctant to take any steps that would impose a political cost on them within their societies because both societies are divided.
Prime minister Netanyahu just got elected. So, he represents the democratic result of a free and open election in Israel, and the strong sentiment among his party and his supporters, not ever to be — for there not ever to be a Palestinian state on the West Bank. On the other hand, there are many Israelis who favor a two state solution. On the Palestinian side, it is about 50/50. You have Fatah, the principal party of the Palestinian Authority headed by the President Abbas, who favor a two state solution, and who favor peaceful, nonviolent negotiation to get there. On the other hand, Hamas, about half, and centered primarily in Gaza, who are opposed to an Israeli state, who are opposed to — who want to retain the right to use violence to end the occupation, as they say, and so both sides are divided. And if any leader takes a — makes a concession, he gets domestic, political criticism. Well, if you not think there’s ever going to be an agreement because the other guy is not sincere, you’re not willing to take steps to move in that direction. That is at the core of this problem, and I think that is what has to be overcome.
AARON MATÉ: But, Senator, on the issue of Hamas, first of all, they were elected in 2006, so they are a legitimate government in Gaza, whether or not the U.S. or Israel like them or not, but Israel won’t deal with them. But also, on the issue of even Israeli and Palestinian statehood, hasn’t Hamas basically tacitly accepted Israel’s right to exist within its 67’ borders, because Hamas has said, we would accept a Palestinian state in the occupied territories. In doing so, you are basically saying that we recognize Israel, even if we don’t directly do it.
SEN. GEORGE MITCHELL: Well, first off, they won a parliamentary election. Their government is divided into an executive and a parliament. They didn’t win the presidency. What was at stake was the parliamentary election. President Abbas remained the democratically elected leader of the country. They, then, in a violent uprising defeated the forces of President Abbas and Fatah and evicted them from Gaza, and seized both executive and parliamentary control in Gaza, so let’s be clear about that. They didn’t win control of Gaza in an election. They won control of Gaza in a military action, which expelled the forces of the Palestinian Authority.
Secondly, Hamas has prevented has prevented any election from occurring since then. They have the interesting political approach that they criticize Abbas as being illegitimate because he hasn’t been reelected since his term expired. The reason he hasn’t been reelected is that they won’t permit an election to occur in Gaza, and there are questions about whether an election could occur in Jerusalem as well. Secondly, on the issue of the Hamas and Israel — you say tacitly. Well, if you are an Israeli and someone says, well, look, I will do this tacitly, but I won’t explicitly, you’d be suspicious, and the Israelis rightly are. That they say — Hamas doesn’t say we tacitly recognize Israel, other people say it, as you have said it. Hamas says we’re against Israel. So, I think you have to be careful about implying a belief in someone who states the opposite, and rather, I think, you should rely on their actions. And so, I have always felt that if we could get real talk going between the Palestinian Authority and the Israelis that had a serious basis for proceeding, that is the best way to draw Hamas in and get them to reverse their positions that now represent the impediment to their participation.
Ex-Sen. George Mitchell: Freed Whistleblower on Azerbaijan Corruption Should Never Have Been Jailed
We look at the case of Frederic "Rick" Bourke, who is considered a whistleblower after he was imprisoned for exposing corruption and bribery in the oil-rich region of the Caspian Sea. Bourke is known for founding the luxury handbag company Dooney & Bourke and is a philanthropist who has invested his wealth into ventures seeking novel cures for cancer. In the mid-1990s, he met a Czech national named Viktor Kozeny who recruited investors for the takeover of SOCAR, the state-owned oil company of Azerbaijan. Serious investors vetted the opportunity and sank huge sums into the enterprise, including our guest, former Senate Majority Leader George Mitchell, as well as Columbia University’s investment fund, the insurance giant AIG, and legendary hedge-fund manager Lee Cooperman, a longtime executive at Goldman Sachs. But the investment failed, and Kozeny absconded with the remaining funds. Bourke was recently released from prison, while Kozeny was never punished. When asked if Bourke should be exonerated, Mitchell responds, "I do not believe he should have been convicted in the first place."
TRANSCRIPT
This is a rush transcript. Copy may not be in its final form.
AMY GOODMAN: Senator Mitchell, I wanted to ask you a different question. We have been following the strange case of Rick Bourke, Frederick Bourke. It’s about a country that borders Iran, Azerbaijan. In the wake of the Soviet collapse, privatization of countries was happening at a record level, and it was believed Azerbaijan would privatize its oil supply. There were many who had invested in this — Columbia University, AIG, you did, Frederick Bourke did, who founded Dooney and Bourke, the handbag company. In the end, the money was stolen. As Rick Bourke’s attorney, Michael Tigar, said, "[Victor] Kozeny was a crook. He stole every bit of Rick Bourke’s money and all of the other investors’ money. He bribed Azeri officials. He lives today happily unextradited in the Bahamas."
Ultimately, the only person that went to jail was Rick Bourke. The Government Accountability Project called him a whistleblower, yet he has just come out of jail. Do you believe he is a whistleblower, and you believe that he should be exonerated.
SEN. GEORGE MITCHELL: Well, I believe that he should not have been convicted in the trial, in which conviction did occur. I think it was a very unfortunate circumstance, and as you describe it, regrettable from Rick Bourke’s standpoint.
AMY GOODMAN: Do you believe he should now be exonerated, to be able to clear his name fully?
SEN. GEORGE MITCHELL: Well, yes, but I’m not sure what process would occur. He was tried, convicted. The conviction was upheld on appeal. But, as I said, I repeat, I do not believe he should have been convicted in the first place.
AMY GOODMAN: Well, Senator George Mitchell, we want to thank you very much for joining us. Senator Mitchell served as the U.S. special envoy for Middle East Peace under President Obama from 2009 to 2011. He previously served under President Bill Clinton, as the Special Envoy for Northern Ireland, where he helped broker the Belfast Peace Agreement of 1998. Before that, Senator Mitchell served as Democratic Senator from Maine for 15 years, including as Senate Majority Leader from 1989 to 1995. This is democracy now. When we come back, we’re talking about Indiana. Stay with us.
Headlines:
Iran Nuclear Talks Conclude with Plans for New Phase
Six days of historic talks aimed at a nuclear deal with Iran are wrapping up in Lausanne, Switzerland. Today marks a self-imposed deadline for the deal between Iran, the United States and five other world powers. The Associated Press reports the talks will conclude with an agreement to continue a new phase aimed at reaching a comprehensive accord by the end of June. Speaking before he rejoined talks today, Russian foreign minister Sergei Lavrov said prospects for a deal are good.
Sergei Lavrov: "The perspectives of this round of talks are not bad, I would even say they are good. The chances are high. They are probably not 100 percent, but you can never be 100 percent certain of anything. These chances are quite 'doable' if none of the talks’ parties raise the stakes at the last minute, hoping to gain something extra in the final stage instead of preserving the balance of interests."
Iraq: U.S. Rejects Claim Drone Strike Killed Iranian Advisors
The Pentagon has rejected claims a U.S. drone strike killed two Iranian military advisors who were aiding Iraqi attempts to retake the city of Tikrit from the self-proclaimed Islamic State. Iran said the two men were killed on March 23, two days before the United States said it began airstrikes.
Yemen: 40 Killed at Refugee Camp as Saudi-Led Strikes Intensify
Saudi-led forces have intensified their aerial bombardment of Yemen and launched strikes from warships around Aden in a bid to prevent Houthi rebels from advancing on the city. On Monday, at least 40 people were reportedly killed when an airstrike hit the Al Mazraq camp for displaced people in a Houthi-controlled area in the north. According to Doctors Without Borders, about 500 new families had arrived at the camp over the past few days, fleeing bombings in other parts of Yemen.
Nigeria: Buhari Poised to Unseat Jonathan in Presidential Poll
In Nigeria, former military ruler Muhammadu Buhari is leading in the presidential election. With over half of states declared, Buhari is ahead by about two million votes, threatening to make President Goodluck Jonathan the first incumbent to lose at the polls in Nigeria’s history. The polling took place amid violent attacks which killed an estimated 50 people. Addressing the U.N. Security Council by video stream, Mohammed Ibn Chambas, head of the U.N. office for West Africa, described the ongoing threat from the militant group Boko Haram.
Mohammed Ibn Chambas: "Today as we meet, though weakened, the group continues to commit horrendous acts against civilians, including women and children. We’ve received reports that children, in particular, have been abducted, abused, recruited, maimed and killed. Schools in northeast Nigeria are no longer safe places of learning, as many of them continue to be attacked, looted and destroyed. Several schools in the areas targeted by Boko Haram in Cameroon and Niger also remain closed."
2 Al Jazeera Journalists Detained for 1 Week in Nigeria
Two Nigerian journalists working for Al Jazeera have been detained in their hotel room in Maiduguri for a week. Nigerian authorities have accused Ahmed Idris and Ali Mustafa of operating without clearance, but Al Jazeera says they are accredited.
Bangladesh: 2nd Secular Blogger Hacked to Death
In Bangladesh, a secular blogger has been hacked to death with machetes in the second such killing in just over a month. Two students have been arrested for killing Oyasiqur Rhaman over his criticism of Islam. Rhaman had expressed solidarity with Avijit Roy, another secular blogger killed last month, posting, "I am Avijit," on social media.
Mexican Farmworkers Continue 2-Week Strike over Low Pay, Harassment
In the Mexican state of Baja California, farmworkers who pick fruit and vegetables for consumers in the United States are continuing a historic, two-week strike. The farmworkers, who may earn in a day about what low-wage U.S. workers earn in an hour, have reportedly rejected the offer of a 15-percent raise. They are demanding a higher raise, benefits, and an end to harassment and other abuses.
Canada: Student to File Charges After Being Hit in Face with Police Tear Gas Canister
In Quebec, an 18-year-old student says she will press charges against a Quebec City police officer after she was hit in the face by a tear-gas canister. Naomi Trudeau-Tremblay was participating in protests against austerity cuts in the provincial budget when an officer fired the tear-gas canister into her face at point-blank range. She described what happened.
Naomi Trudeau-Tremblay: "I was gasping for breath. I didn’t realize right away that I was swollen like this. I just put my hands like this. I was trying to catch my breath, and then I lost consciousness for about two minutes, not too long. When I got up, I touched my face and felt that it was burned."
Police Fatally Shoot Driver Who Failed to Stop Outside NSA
Police at the National Security Agency in Fort Meade, Maryland, shot and killed the driver of a car after he refused calls to stop. Authorities say two men dressed in women’s clothing drove a stolen car down a highway exit reserved for NSA employees. The NSA says the driver failed to stop and "accelerated toward an NSA police vehicle." Police opened fire, killing the driver and injuring the passenger, identified as 20-year-old Kevin Fleming. An officer was also injured. Officials say they found cocaine and at least one gun in the vehicle. It is unclear if the men actually intended to enter the NSA.
States, Businesses Protest After Indiana Enacts Law Seen as Anti-LGBT
Connecticut has become the first state to officially boycott Indiana over a new "religious freedom" law that could allow discrimination by letting businesses refuse service to LGBT people. Washington State, San Francisco and Seattle have also imposed bans on state or city-funded travel to Indiana. Nine chief executive officers, including the heads of Angie’s List and Eli Lilly, wrote letters asking Indiana state officials to "take immediate action" to ensure the act will not sanction or encourage discrimination. Tim Cook, CEO of Apple, the world’s most profitable company, slammed Indiana’s law and others like it, likening it to the Jim Crow laws of the American South. We will have more on the story after headlines.
Prosecutor: Germanwings Co-Pilot Had History of "Suicidal Tendencies"
The Germanwings co-pilot who crashed a plane in the French Alps, killing all 150 people on board, reportedly received treatment for "suicidal tendencies." A German prosecutor said Andreas Lubitz was in treatment for the problems “over a long period” before he received his pilot’s license. Officials are also looking into reports Lubitz suffered from vision problems, which may have been psychosomatic.
Mumia Abu-Jamal Hospitalized in Intensive Care Under Heavy Guard
In Pennsylvania, imprisoned journalist and former Black Panther Mumia Abu-Jamal has been taken to the intensive care unit of a local hospital after he was removed from prison for a medical emergency without notification to his family, friends or lawyers. Friends say they were told he was in "diabetic shock" but they have so far been unable to visit him or obtain any details. Noelle Hanrahan, producer of Prison Radio, which distributes Abu-Jamal’s commentaries from prison, spoke to Democracy Now! from the hospital.
Noelle Hanrahan: "We are standing in the ICU waiting room. We are at the nurses desk. We can see his room, we cannot see him. I am looking at phalanx of police officers. The curtain is pulled across. He has tried to access the healthcare they have for him and it has been woefully indadequate and we are deeply concerned about this. They don’t take people to outside hospital. It is not standard procedure. You have to be extraordinarily sick to be moved, period."
Abu-Jamal’s transfer came the same day as a court hearing on a Pennsylvania law he says tramples his free speech. The law was introduced after Abu-Jamal gave a pretaped commencement address at Vermont’s Goddard College. It authorizes the censoring of prisoners’ public addresses if a judge agree the speech would cause "mental anguish" to victims.
Indiana: Purvi Patel Sentenced to 41 Years for What She Says Was a Miscarriage
In Indiana, Purvi Patel has been sentenced to 41 years in prison for what she says was a miscarriage. Patel was convicted of feticide and felony neglect last month after prosecutors accused her of taking drugs to induce an abortion, even though no drugs were found in her system. She said she miscarried and disposed of her dead fetus in a dumpster. But prosecutors, using scientifically contested evidence, claim the baby was born alive. A judge sentenced her to 30 years for neglect and six for feticide, plus five years probation. The sentences will be served concurrently, with 10 years suspended, making her effective sentence 20 years. The two charges appear mutually exclusive; feticide applies when a fetus dies in the womb, while felony neglect applies to live children, but Patel was convicted of both. Critics say her case showcases the increasing criminalization of pregnancy.
New Arizona Law Requires Doctors to Tell Patients They Can Reverse Drug-Induced Abortion
In Arizona, Gov. Doug Ducey has signed the first-ever law requiring doctors to tell patients they can reverse the effects of a drug-induced abortion, despite a lack of any scientific evidence such a step is actually possible. The law also prevents women from buying insurance policies that cover abortion through the federal marketplace.
Trevor Noah to Replace Jon Stewart as Host of "The Daily Show"
Comedy Central has announced a successor to Jon Stewart, who is stepping down this year as host of "The Daily Show." Trevor Noah, a 31-year-old comedian from South Africa, will be the new host. He debuted on the show last year with the line, "I never thought I’d be more afraid of police in America than in South Africa."
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