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We return to our top story of the day, the killing of at least 12 people in a shooting attack on a French satirical magazine in Paris. Witnesses say masked gunmen entered the offices of Charlie Hebdo and opened fire with automatic weapons. The dead reportedly include four cartoonists and two police officers. A major police operation is underway in the Paris area to catch the killers. Charlie Hebdo has faced attacks and threats for its caricatures of the Prophet Muhammad, which helped spark protests across the Middle East in 2012. We are joined by Tariq Ramadan, a professor of contemporary Islamic studies at Oxford University who is considered one of the most prominent Muslim intellectuals in Europe. Responding to reports the attack was carried out by Islamist militants, Ramadan says: "This is just a pure betrayal of our religion and our principles."
TRANSCRIPT
This is a rush transcript. Copy may not be in its final form.
AMY GOODMAN: We’re going to turn right now—and, by the way, we will link to Juan’s column in the New York Daily News, but we’ve got to return to the top story of the day. Juan?
JUAN GONZÁLEZ: Right, and that’s the killing of at least 12 people in a shooting attack on a French satirical magazine in Paris. Witnesses say masked gunmen entered the offices of the magazine, Charlie Hebdo, and opened fire with automatic weapons. The dead reportedly include four cartoonists and two police officers. A major police operation is underway in the Paris area to catch the killers.
AMY GOODMAN: The magazine Charlie Hebdo has drawn multiple threats for its caricatures of the Prophet Muhammad. In 2012, the magazine’s cartoon depicting Muhammad in pornographic poses helped spark protests across the Middle East.
For more, we’re joined right now by Tariq Ramadan, professor of contemporary Islamic studies at Oxford University in Britain, the author of a number of influential books on Islam in Europe.
Can you respond to these developments in Paris? It looks like at least 12 people dead, a number injured, in this shooting attack on this satirical magazine, this satirical newspaper’s offices. Tariq Ramadan?
TARIQ RAMADAN: Look, first, we have to condemn what has been done and what’s happening in Paris. That’s not—you know, when we are told that what they said is that the prophet of Islam has—it’s a revenge, and this is the way—no, this is just a pure betrayal of our religion and our principles, that that’s not acceptable. And my sympathy goes for the families and the victims. And whatever happened with, you know, the journalists, and one of the journalists who was killed, apparently—I don’t know if this has been confirmed—is someone that I debated in prime-time TV in France, and I didn’t agree with him, and he was quite, you know, offensive in the way he was talking about Islam. But the only thing that we have to say is that we need to enter and to be involved in critical dialogue and critical discussions about what is happening in France and elsewhere in Europe. But by any, any standard, we have to condemn what was done, and say it clearly: This is betraying our principles, our religion and everything we stand for.
JUAN GONZÁLEZ: And, Tariq Ramadan, have you been able to tell from reports whether anyone has claimed responsibility for the attack?
TARIQ RAMADAN: So far, there is—the only thing that we know is that they talked about Islam. They were talking about the prophet, and they said this is a revenge. So the only thing that they are connecting this to, what the satirical journal or magazine was doing. This is the only thing that I heard so far. But, once again, there is quite clearly a connection that was done by the people who did it, when they were leaving. And this is why—and it’s quite clear that this is—it is, you know, Charlie Hebdo, was known for a series of controversial publications over the last two or three years, and I think that the connection is quite clear. So this is why we have to be clear as much as is needed today.
AMY GOODMAN: What do you think is most important to understand right now? I mean, there have been a series of attacks on journalists and newspapers that have parodied, that have caricatured the Prophet Muhammad. In this latest attack, this is clearly the biggest attack that’s ever taken place in—
TARIQ RAMADAN: I think that, once again, we know what happened in—you know, some of the slogans and some of the statements coming from people like Da’ish, or the so-called Islamic State in Iraq and in Syria, they are using some of the controversial issues around the world and targeting journalists or targeting intellectuals and, in fact, trying to focus on some of the sensitive issues in specific countries. So this is where, as Western Muslims—as Muslims as a whole, but also as Western Muslims—we have to be quite clear on the fact that the critical discussion that is now necessary in our Western societies, be it in the States or in Europe or in France, we have to be involved. We have to make it clear that—there should be no confusion—Islamophobia is the racism, is the—but it’s only as citizens, it’s only in the critical debate, it’s only with all the forces and all the trends within our societies that are against any type of racism, that we are going to resist and reform the minds and the hearts of our fellow citizens. And it could never be accepted, never be supported, such actions that are now instrumentalizing some of the frustrations that we have in the West as to, you know, equal citizenship and racism, and using this to support what is in fact not acceptable and has to be condemned. So, there is here a danger for us to see some of our fellow Muslims—
AMY GOODMAN: Tariq Ramadan, we must leave it there, but I hope you will join us tomorrow, professor of contemporary Islamic studies at Oxford University, visiting professor at the Faculty of Islamic Studies in Qatar [sic], author of a number of influential books on Islam and Europe, was named by Time magazine as one of the most important innovators of the 21st century.
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Charlie Hebdo Shooting: 12 Killed in Attack on French Satirical Magazine Known for Muhammad Cartoons
At least 12 people have been killed in a shooting attack on a French satirical magazine in Paris. Witnesses say masked gunmen entered the offices of the magazine, Charlie Hebdo, and opened fire. The dead include four cartoonists and two police officers. The magazine Charlie Hebdo has drawn multiple threats for its caricatures of the Prophet Muhammad. In 2012, the magazine’s cartoon depicting Muhammad in pornographic poses helped spark protests across the Middle East. The outcry forced France to close embassies and other official sites in 20 countries. Charlie Hebdo has repeatedly claimed it publishes the cartoons as a defender of free expression and against religious extremism. We are joined by two guests: Robert Mahoney, deputy director of the Committee to Protect Journalists; and Tariq Ali, a British-Pakistani political commentator, historian, activist, filmmaker, novelist and an editor of the New Left Review.
TRANSCRIPT
This is a rush transcript. Copy may not be in its final form.
JUAN GONZÁLEZ: At least 12 people have been killed in a shooting attack on a French satirical magazine in Paris. Witnesses say masked gunmen entered the offices of the magazine, Charlie Hebdo, and opened fire. According to Agence France-Presse, two of the dead are police officers. A major police operation is underway in Paris—in the Paris area to catch the killers.
AMY GOODMAN: The magazine Charlie Hebdo has drawn multiple threats for its caricatures of the Prophet Muhammad. In 2012, the magazine’s cartoon depicting Muhammad in pornographic poses helped sparked protests across the Middle East. The outcry forced France to close embassies and other official sites in 20 countries.
Charlie Hebdo has repeatedly claimed it publishes the cartoons as a defender of free expression and against religious extremism. Speaking at the scene of the attack, French President François Hollande said barbaric people had carried out "an attack on free speech."
We’re joined now by two guests. Robert Mahoney is the deputy director of the Committee to Protect Journalists. And Tariq Ali is with us, the British-Pakistani political commentator, historian, filmmaker, novelist, editor of the New Left Review.
Let’s go first to Robert Mahoney. What do you know about what’s taken place at this point, Robert?
ROBERT MAHONEY: Well, at this point, French media is reporting that two masked gunmen attacked the magazine in the heart of Paris, opened fire. We know officially that at least two policemen were killed, but now we’re getting reports that up to four journalists at Charlie Hebdo were killed, including some of their most famous cartoonists.
JUAN GONZÁLEZ: And, Robert Mahoney, in terms of attacks on journalists in Europe, this has to be, obviously, the worst of its kind, but could you talk about the climate generally there?
ROBERT MAHONEY: Yeah, this is unprecedented. I mean, Charlie Hebdo is a satirical magazine that’s been in trouble before. It was firebombed back in 2011 after it published a spoof edition, which it said was, quote, "guest-edited" by the Prophet Muhammad. It has angered sections of the Islamic community in France and beyond. And back in 2006, you may remember the cartoons of the Prophet Muhammad that were published in Denmark. Well, Charlie Hebdo reprinted those cartoons. So, for the last six years or so, it’s been in the forefront of a battle over freedom of expression with certain sections of Islamist groups.
AMY GOODMAN: Tariq Ali, you’re in London right now. I mean, this is all unfolding as we speak. Can you talk about the significance of what has happened so far? Again, 12 people shot dead in the offices of Charlie Hebdo, the satirical magazine in Paris.
TARIQ ALI: Amy, I’ve just been in touch with friends in France, and basically they say that one of the journalists killed is the long-standing cartoonist of Charlie Hebdo, Charb, the name he signed under. And he is someone who has been active in this magazine for many, many years, and there is no doubt that he was deliberately targeted by the assassins who went to hit him.
The other thing that has been pointed out is that yesterday the magazine had a tweet which mocked the pretensions of the so-called caliph, the leader of the Islamic State, ISIS, and that that could be another reason.
Now, there are two things that are worth pointing out. A, that the attacks on the prophet, Muhammad, which they—when they mimicked the Danish magazine, as been pointed out, did cause a lot of offense to Muslim believers all over the world, and when asked, the Danish magazine effectively had said that, no, they would not have published similar attacks against Moses, regardless of what Israel was doing in Palestine. This angered people even further. And the question was then posed: Well, why target the prophet of Islam, when you do not and could not target or do not wish to target Moses for all the mayhem that is going on in Palestine? To which there was no reply. So there is a feeling, effectively, that there is—
AMY GOODMAN: I’m sure you’re going to be getting a lot of calls, Tariq, but just keep going.
TARIQ ALI: OK. So, there were a lot of—there was some anger at this targeting that is taking place. And, of course, I emphasize that nothing justifies attacks of this sort on either these or any other journalists. They can be combated verbally. They can be combated with counter-cartoons, etc. But this sort of killing, which started with the fatwa on Salman Rushdie, is unacceptable and doesn’t do the Islamic religion as a whole any favors.
But at the same time, Amy, there is quite an ugly atmosphere of Islamophobia in parts of Europe. We had big demonstrations in Germany by Islamophobes saying that Germany was getting Islamized. The well-known French right-wing novelist Houellebecq has just published a new novel in which the central fact is that by 2020 France will have a Muslim president. From the other side, Edwy Plenel, the publisher of the French investigative online magazine Mediapart, has written a book attacking and announcing Islamophobia very strongly. So, it’s an ugly atmosphere in parts of Europe, and this will play into it, and it just creates a vicious cycle.
JUAN GONZÁLEZ: And, Tariq, what has been the response of government leaders in France, Germany and Britain to this rise of anti-immigrant and anti-Muslim sentiment across the continent?
TARIQ ALI: Well, the German chancellor, Angela Merkel, to her credit, two days ago, denounced these demonstrations and said that targeting ethnic minorities is unacceptable. She meant, of course, in Germany. But to this, then, a newspaper one normally regards as a very right-wing newspaper, the largest newspaper in Germany, Bild-Zeitung, a tabloid newspaper, has also published a public attack on the right and far right for carrying out these demonstrations targeting Muslims and published a letter signed by 50 top politicians and intellectuals, including former Chancellor Helmut Schmidt, saying that this sort of behavior is unacceptable. So the German government has come out relatively well on this.
In France, it is not exactly the same. You have a lot of Islamophobia encouraged by politicians of the far right. You have mainstream politicians then pandering to this and saying, "Yes, there is a problem." In Britain, there’s a big debate now going on on immigration—not on Islam, it has to be said, but on immigration—targeting migrants and saying there are too many migrants here, again started by the far right, and again those pandering to it are people from the mainstream political parties.
AMY GOODMAN: Can you give us, Robert, a history of the kind of attacks on outlets, newspapers, magazines, that have published cartoons of the Prophet Muhammad?
ROBERT MAHONEY: Well, if you go back to 2006, where the first attacks and death threats were against—
AMY GOODMAN: Can you come directly onto the telephone? We’re having a problem hearing you.
ROBERT MAHONEY: I said the first attacks were against Jyllands-Posten, the Danish paper that published a cartoon—
AMY GOODMAN: Let me go back to Tariq, because we’re having a problem hearing you. Tariq, let me put that question to you: If you can give people a sense of the history of these kind of attacks?
TARIQ ALI: [inaudible] first big attacks came in the Danish paper, a right-wing conservative paper which, as many of my Danish friends pointed out at the time, during the Second World War had been closely allied to the Third Reich and the Nazis, and that this newspaper was leading this particular form of struggle, supposedly for free speech, but effectively targeting Islam, the Islamic religion and its prophet. This then became a big free speech issue and was mimicked elsewhere, including by Charlie Hebdo in France. Now, the more cynical people in France said the Charlie Hebdo circulation was failing, going down, and they needed to revive it, and the best way to revive it was of course by becoming campaigners for free speech and publishing provocative attacks on Islam as such. So, they, of course, denied it. It became a big free speech issue. And many people said that it was two forms of fundamentalism fighting each other—A, a tiny group of Islamic fundamentalists targeting these magazines, and B, secular fundamentalists trying to provoke and anger people, in general—and that neither was doing anyone a favor.
AMY GOODMAN: Tariq Ali and Robert Mahoney, we want to thank you for being with us. We’ll continue to bring people the latest as we learn it. At this point what we know is 12 people have been killed, shot dead in the satirical newspaper Charlie Hebdo’s offices—they have recently published cartoons of the Prophet Muhammad—10 journalists and two police, we believe. Reuters is reporting that others have been critically injured. This is in Paris, France. Tariq Ali is the British-Pakistani political commentator, historian, filmmaker, novelist, editor of the New Left Review. And Robert Mahoney is deputy director of the Committee to Protect Journalists.
This is Democracy Now!, democracynow.org, The War and Peace Report. When we come back, we’ll talk about the Ferguson grand jury and a grand juror who wants to speak out. If a grand juror in Missouri speaks out, the person could face up to a year in prison. Stay with us.
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In a closely watched press freedom case, New York Times investigative reporter James Risen was called to the witness stand Monday after a seven-year legal battle against the government’s attempts to subpoena him and force him to reveal his source. The hearing in Virginia took place ahead of the trial of former CIA officer Jeffrey Sterling, who is accused of giving Risen classified information which revealed a botched CIA plot to disrupt Iran’s nuclear program. It is unclear yet if Risen will be called to testify at Sterling’s trial. Without more information from Risen, Sterling’s defense attorney argues the case should be dismissed. We are joined by Matt Apuzzo, a colleague of Risen’s at The New York Times who is covering the case. During his previous stint with the Associated Press, Apuzzo and Adam Goldman won a Pulitzer Prize for their coverage of the NYPD’s Muslim surveillance program. The Department of Justice opened three separate investigations into leaks related to their reports.
TRANSCRIPT
This is a rush transcript. Copy may not be in its final form.
AMY GOODMAN: This is Democracy Now!, democracynow.org, The War and Peace Report. I’m Amy Goodman. Our top story, 12 dead in the offices of a French satirical magazine. They were shot dead. They had recently published cartoons of the Prophet Muhammad. In our next segment, we’re going to talk about a Ferguson grand juror who would like to speak out, but right now, Juan?
JUAN GONZÁLEZ: Well, we turn to a freedom of the press case Democracy Now! has followed closely. New York Times investigative reporter James Risen was called to the witness stand Monday after a seven-year legal battle against the government’s attempts to subpoena him and force him to reveal his sources. The hearing in Virginia took place ahead of the trial of former CIA officer Jeffrey Sterling, who is accused of giving Risen classified information that revealed a botched CIA plot to disrupt Iran’s nuclear program. It’s unclear yet if Risen will be called to testify at Sterling’s trial. Without more information from Risen, Sterling’s defense attorney argues the case should be dismissed.
AMY GOODMAN: In a minute, we’ll get an update from New York Times reporter Matt Apuzzo, who was in the courtroom when James Risen testified. But first, this is a clip of a speech Apuzzo cites in his news account of the hearing of Risen in his own words speaking about press freedom under Obama as he accepted the Lovejoy Award at Colby College in Maine.
JAMES RISEN: By launching criminal investigations of stories that are outside the mainstream coverage, they are trying to, in effect, build a pathway on which journalism can be conducted: Stay on the interstate highway of conventional wisdom with your journalism, and you will have no problems; try to get off and challenge basic assumptions, and you will face punishment. Journalists have no choice but to fight back, because if they don’t, they will become irrelevant.
AMY GOODMAN: That’s New York Times investigative reporter, Pulitzer Prize-winning journalist James Risen speaking at Colby College in October.
For more, we go to Washington, D.C., to another New York Times Pulitzer Prize-winning reporter, Matt Apuzzo. He covers national security. During his time with the Associated Press, Matt and Adam Goldman won a Pulitzer Prize for their coverage of the NYPD’s Muslim surveillance program. The Department of Justice opened three separate investigations into leaks related to their reports. Apuzzo was in the courtroom Monday when James Risen testified, and wrote about it in his piece headlined "Defiant on Witness Stand, Times Reporter Says Little."
Matt, Welcome back to Democracy Now! Describe the scene in the courtroom and just what you remember James Risen saying.
MATT APUZZO: Well, so, it was a—it was a tense, tense moment. You know, Jim took the stand, obviously, reluctantly. He had been fighting this for about seven years, trying to stay off the stand. He took this fight to the Supreme Court. The Supreme Court declined to hear it, so he was under order to testify.
But very weirdly sort of at the last minute, kind of under pressure from journalist groups and civil rights groups, the attorney general, Eric Holder, made a decision and said that his prosecutors were not going to force Risen to give up his source, and so the questioning was really weird. It was sort of like, "If I asked you who your source was, what would you say?" And, of course, he said, "Well, I wouldn’t say it." So it was this weird dance where the government was basically trying to say, "Did you have a confidential source? Did you promise a source confidentiality?" and was just trying to like nibble around the edges.
And a lot of those questions, almost all those questions, Risen had answered in an affidavit years ago, just saying, "This is a confidential-source arrangement I’ve had, and I’m not going to give up any information." But even that, even that basic information, was sort of like pulling teeth with Jim on the stand.
JUAN GONZÁLEZ: So, what does this mean in terms of Sterling’s actual trial? Was it your sense that Risen will be called as a witness in the trial?
MATT APUZZO: You know, it’s hard to say. I don’t totally understand what the government gets from having Jim on the stand, but, of course, I don’t see the whole case so I don’t know what—you know, it’s hard for me to see the value, but that at this stage it’s not unusual. I suppose there’s value for him helping them kind of bolster their circumstantial case, right? I mean, he can say, "Yes, I interviewed Jeffrey Sterling on the record for this 2002 Times story that’s unrelated to this case," so clearly establishing that he knew Sterling, and then say, "Yes, I had these confidential sources for chapter nine in my book," and then the government introduces the sort of the electronic records, the phone records and email records that show they were in contact around that time. And I suppose in that case, Risen’s testimony helps them bolster their circumstantial case.
But the defense says, "Hey, look, without Risen testifying, you have no evidence proving that Sterling was the one who gave up this information. Simply saying they talked to each other doesn’t prove anything." So, it’s quite possible that the defense will call him, because, you know, he testified at this preliminary hearing that he had multiple sources. So, that obviously could be helpful for Sterling, so it’s possible he ends up testifying as a defense witness. So, it’s a very odd moment we’re in right now.
AMY GOODMAN: Speaking on Democracy Now! just a few months ago, Jim Risen emphasized the importance of confidential sources for a free press.
JAMES RISEN: Without aggressive investigative reporting, we can’t really have a democracy, because the only real oversight for the government is an independent and aggressive press. And I think that’s what the government really fears more than anything else, is an aggressive investigative reporting in which we shine a light on what’s going on inside the government. And we can’t do that without maintaining the confidentiality of sources.
AMY GOODMAN: That was Jim Risen on Democracy Now! In court on Monday, he said, "I am not going to provide the government with information that they seem to want to use to create a mosaic to prove or disprove certain facts." Matt, can you take our listeners and viewers back to why exactly Jim Risen has been pursued for seven years, beginning with the George W. Bush administration and then, to his shock, right through the two Obama administrations?
MATT APUZZO: Sure. So, you know, I think this really starts around the time that Risen and Eric Lichtblau reported in the Times and also in Jim’s book about the NSA’s warrantless wiretap program. Obviously, that spurned a large investigation, so the government was clearly looking for their sources in that story in early 2006. You know, I think there’s—that may have morphed into this case, where now they’re looking at this chapter nine, where Risen writes in his book about this botched CIA operation in Iran where the CIA gave nuclear schematics to Iran that they had sort of—that they had introduced flaws, design flaws, to in hopes of setting back the nuclear program, but Jim’s book reveals that these flaws were easily spottable and that Iran probably just worked right around them, so we may have actually even helped advance the nuclear program.
So, there’s this big leak investigation in John Rizzo’s book, the former CIA general counsel. He has this amazing scene where he describes where the CIA and the White House finally see this book, Risen’s book, and they’re—it’s New Year’s Eve, and they’re desperate to figure out how can they stop it from hitting the shelves, how can they stop State of War from hitting the shelves. And, you know, they’re working all night to see, you know, "Can we get all the books recalled?" And, I mean, finally, obviously, they realized that logistically that was impossible. So the book comes out, there’s a big leak investigation.
And ultimately they focus on Jeffrey Sterling, who was a CIA officer involved in this Iran program. And Risen’s been fighting efforts to get—the government’s been trying to put him on the stand for years, first through Attorney General Mukasey and then ultimately through Attorney General Holder, have been trying to put him on the stand for years. And he’s been fighting for seven years.
JUAN GONZÁLEZ: And, Matt, what about this Dr. Jekyll/Mr. Hyde personality of the Obama administration, on the one hand saying that they’re not going to jail journalists, but on the other hand a constant crackdown on whistleblowers—a key ingredient for any investigative journalist—and their attempts to go after the sources of reporters?
MATT APUZZO: Well, I think there’s two things to take from that. One is, this is clearly a course correction for Eric Holder, right? I mean, there are more leak investigations, more prosecutions than all other administrations combined. But now, as the sort of the tenure is winding down and there’s been this kind of blowback and, you know, the kind of criticism he’s gotten from civil rights groups, you know, people who would traditionally be his strongest supporters, from journalist groups, I think he’s sort of saying, you know, "Geez, maybe we went too far." And he has said, "Maybe we’ve gone too far." And, you know, they’ve rewritten the guidelines for subpoenaing journalists. They’ve rewritten the guidelines for when you can take their phone records, as they did in our case. And he said that one of his biggest—that his biggest regret of his tenure was labeling James Rosen, the Fox News reporter, as a criminal co-conspirator for asking a State Department contractor about classified information. I mean, that was very—I mean, that was a startling thing for every reporter to see, the idea that just asking somebody about national security makes you potentially a criminal. So Holder said that was a regret, that maybe this crackdown has gone too far.
And so there’s tension, right? I mean, his prosecutors say, "We can’t win this case against Sterling if we don’t put Risen on the stand." So Holder is trying to split the baby a little bit here. He’s saying, "OK, you can subpoena him, but you can’t put them in a position where he’d be in contempt of court, and you can’t get him thrown in jail." So they’re not asking him about his source. And, you know, who knows how this is going to play out at trial?
AMY GOODMAN: Matt, you worked for the Associated Press. It’s where you won the Pulitzer Prize before working for the Times. And in 2013, the AP reported the Department of Justice had secretly obtained a trove of journalists’ phone records in what AP’s chief executive called a "massive and unprecedented intrusion"—
MATT APUZZO: Right.
AMY GOODMAN: —seizing the records for the work and personal phone numbers of individual reporters in New York, Washington, Hartford, including you. Can you talk more about that and what it meant for reporting in this country?
MATT APUZZO: Sure. So, this was based off a story that I wrote with Adam Goldman and Eileen Sullivan, and our phone records were—our phone records were seized, along with the sort of the general phone number to the Washington bureau, my old phone number in Hartford, Connecticut, which I hadn’t used in, you know, eight years probably at that point. And we found out about it months later in just an email notice that, "Hey, by the way, we seized all your phone records"—cellphone records, home records, home phone records from my editor, my cellphone records, Adam’s cellphone records, Eileen’s cellphone records, others at the AP. It was a real startling moment. I think the AP’s lawyers and AP’s executives responded really well. But at that point, what can you do? I mean, you can’t say, "Unsee my phone records. Give them back." You’ve already—they’ve already mined the phone records. That was a real—I mean, a real watershed moment, I think, in this debate over the reach of the government into the fourth estate.
AMY GOODMAN: And finally, Eric Holder, the attorney general, right now and his relationship with journalists as he is shaping his legacy, already announcing his departure?
MATT APUZZO: Yeah, I mean, this is certainly going to be a part of his legacy, probably one that he—well, one he said he thinks he’s not necessarily proud of. It’s interesting because, you know, I wrote a story about him when he announced he was leaving that talked about his civil rights legacy. And, you know, civil rights groups have universally said he’s done an amazing job on the sort of traditional Democratic liberal civil rights issues, but at the same time has a lot of his supporters on the left really scratching their heads on why he’s not better on civil liberties, you know, certainly in the national security realm, but privacy, state secrets, journalists. So, that’s really part of the—as you said, Jekyll and Hyde is one way to say it, I guess, but really it’s just sort of the complex nature of Eric Holder as an attorney general.
AMY GOODMAN: Matt Apuzzo, we want to thank you very much for being with us, Pulitzer Prize-winning reporter, now at The New York Times, in the courtroom Monday when James Risen testified. Matt Apuzzo wrote about it in his article, "Defiant on Witness Stand, Times Reporter Says Little." We’ll link to that piece at democracynow.org.
As we move from civil liberties to civil rights, we’ll go to Missouri to talk about a grand juror who wants to speak out but faces a year in prison if the grand juror speaks out. We’ll speak to their lawyer. Stay with us.
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A member of the grand jury that declined to indict Ferguson police officer Darren Wilson for fatally shooting unarmed African American Michael Brown is suing for the right to speak publicly about the case. The lawsuit accuses Prosecuting Attorney Bob McCulloch of presenting possible charges to the grand jury in a "muddled and untimely manner," and notes the case had a "stronger focus on the victim" than other cases. It also challenges "the implication that all grand jurors believed that there was no support for any charges" against Wilson. The juror is challenging a lifetime ban preventing grand jury members from discussing cases. The grand juror has been identified only as a St. Louis County resident. We are joined by Tony Rothert, the legal director of the American Civil Liberties Union of Missouri, which is representing the unnamed juror.
TRANSCRIPT
This is a rush transcript. Copy may not be in its final form.
JUAN GONZÁLEZ: We turn now to Missouri, where a member of the grand jury that declined to indict Ferguson police officer Darren Wilson for fatally shooting unarmed African American Michael Brown is suing for the right to speak publicly about the case. The lawsuit accuses Prosecuting Attorney Bob McCulloch of presenting possible charges to the grand jury in a, quote, "muddled and untimely manner," and notes the case had a, quote, "stronger focus on the victim," Michael Brown, than other cases. It also challenges, quote, "the implication that all grand jurors believed that there was no support for any charges" against Wilson. The juror is challenging a lifetime ban preventing a grand jury member from discussing cases. The grand juror has been identified only as a St. Louis County resident and is being represented by the American Civil Liberties Union.
AMY GOODMAN: Meanwhile, several Missouri residents have filed a bar complaint against Prosecuting Attorney Bob McCulloch and two assistant prosecuting attorneys in the handling of the grand jury. According to the complaint, the prosecutors violated 15 Missouri Rules of Professional Conduct.
This comes as the NAACP Legal Defense Fund has asked a Missouri judge to convene a new grand jury to consider charges against Officer Darren Wilson. On Monday, the NAACP Legal Defense and Educational Fund submitted a letter to St. Louis County Circuit Judge Maura McShane requesting an investigation into the grand jury proceedings that led to the decision not to indict Wilson.
We go to Kansas City, Missouri, where we’re joined by Tony Rothert, the legal director of the American Civil Liberties Union in Missouri. He’s the attorney for the grand juror who’s challenging Missouri’s grand jury secrecy law.
Welcome to Democracy Now! So, can you lay out for us the law in Missouri that dictates what a grand juror can or cannot do, especially in light of the fact that the prosecutor can speak out all he wants, talking about Bob McCulloch?
TONY ROTHERT: Right. So, the law in Missouri is the same as it is in most states. Grand jurors are not allowed to speak at all, not about the evidence that they heard, their opinions about the evidence, or the legal counsel they received from the state. And usually, you know, prosecutors don’t speak about what happens in a grand jury, either, at least not in great detail.
This is an unusual case in that the prosecutor has—he purports to have been transparent, to have released all the evidence and to have released all the transcripts of the hearings before the grand jury. And also the prosecutor has spoken quite a bit about what the grand jurors thought, especially, you know, about particular evidence and overall. And yet the grand jurors themselves, the only people who could contradict the prosecutor’s story that he’s putting out there, the government line on this, are forever banned from speaking.
JUAN GONZÁLEZ: And in addition to that, the prosecutor has admitted that he knowingly put before the grand jurors witnesses who he believed were not telling the truth or suspected were not telling the truth, an extraordinary admission, it seems to me, for a prosecutor. From what you have seen of the released minutes, what questions does your client have about the public record versus what actually happened in the grand jury?
TONY ROTHERT: Well, I think the biggest thing that our client—one of the bigger things that this person has to offer is the contrast in how this grand jury proceeding was from other grand jury proceedings. So, this grand jury had been together for several months and heard hundreds of cases. They usually lasted 10 or 15 minutes. And there are many ways in which the Darren Wilson investigation was completely different—not only that it took longer, not only that prosecutors put on witnesses they didn’t believe were telling the truth, but also how the grand jury was instructed about the law, which is, ultimately, very important to what their decision is.
AMY GOODMAN: I want to ask exactly what happened during the grand jury proceedings. According to the released grand jury documents, the assistant district attorney, Kathi Alizadeh, said to the jurors, quote, "I know this is different than other cases because normally when we’ve charged somebody with an offense, you have the charge in front of you, you can read what the charge is, you can read what maybe the elements are and you don’t have that in this case." Tony Rothert, can you explain the significance of this?
TONY ROTHERT: So, normally, even from the records we have, we know that when the grand jury—before they start hearing evidence, they know what they’re looking at. They know what the elements of the crime are, so they know what they need to match up to return an indictment. Here, it looks like the grand jury is left in the dark. They weren’t told what the law was until the very end. And in some respects, with regarding self-defense, they were told the law—you know, about an unconstitutional Missouri law. So, it just wasn’t clear to the grand jury, I don’t believe, that—what the law was and what indictments they could return and what evidence they would need to know.
AMY GOODMAN: So, Tony Rothert, would the grand juror, if the grand juror spoke out—we don’t know if the grand juror is a man or a woman—face a year in prison?
TONY ROTHERT: Right. So, you know, this person came to us originally with an interest in speaking out and wondering, you know, what would happen to me if I did this. And I think it’s troubling. You know, just before the prosecuting attorney went out and gave an hour-long press conference detailing what the grand jury did, the grand jurors were handed copies of the Missouri laws that make it a misdemeanor offense to speak out about anything, anything that happened as part of a grand jury. So, you know, these folks are afraid, reasonably so, I think, to speak out. Also, just because it’s a peculiar situation, the person who they might contradict is Bob McCulloch, the prosecuting attorney, who would also be the person who has the discretion to decide whether or not to charge them with violating the grand jury secrecy laws.
AMY GOODMAN: Well, Tony Rothert, we’ll certainly continue to follow this, legal director of the American Civil Liberties Union of Missouri. He’s the attorney for the grand juror who’s challenging Missouri’s grand jury secrecy law, speaking to us from Kansas City, Missouri. This is Democracy Now!, democracynow.org, The War and Peace Report. I’m Amy Goodman, with Juan González.
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The late three-term Democratic Governor Mario Cuomo of New York was laid to rest on Tuesday following his death on January 1. Cuomo was known for supporting abortion rights, despite his Catholic faith, and opposing the death penalty, among other causes, although he also expanded the state’s prison system. Cuomo is the father of the current New York governor, Andrew Cuomo, who delivered the eulogy at the Church of St. Ignatius Loyola. Mario Cuomo is often remembered for his speeches, including his 1984 address at the Democratic National Convention, when he challenged President Ronald Reagan’s description of the United States as a "shining city on a hill." Democracy Now! co-host and New York Daily News columnist Juan González discusses Cuomo’s life and legacy.
TRANSCRIPT
This is a rush transcript. Copy may not be in its final form.
JUAN GONZÁLEZ: In New York City on Tuesday, hundreds attended the funeral for former three-term Democratic New York Governor Mario Cuomo, including President Bill Clinton and former Secretary of State Hillary Clinton. Cuomo died New Year’s Day at the age of 82. He was known for supporting abortion rights, despite his Catholic faith, and opposing the death penalty, among other things, although he also expanded the state’s prison system. Mario Cuomo is the father of the current New York governor, Andrew Cuomo, who delivered the eulogy at the Church of St. Ignatius Loyola.
GOV. ANDREW CUOMO: At his core, at his best, he was a philosopher, and he was a poet, and he was an advocate, and he was a crusader. Mario Cuomo was the keynote speaker for our better angels. By any measure, Mario Cuomo’s voice inspired generations. His government initiatives helped millions live better lives. He left the world a better place than he found it. His list of accomplishments goes on and on—leading opponent of the death penalty, appointing the first African-American and Hispanic judge to the court of appeals, the first two females, his Liberty Scholarship programs, his pioneering child health insurance program, leader in AIDS treatment and research. New York is a better state, thanks to Mario Cuomo.
AMY GOODMAN: That’s New York Governor Andrew Cuomo. His father, Mario Cuomo, is often remembered for his speeches, including his 1984 address at the Democratic National Convention, when he challenged President Ronald Reagan’s description of the United States as a "shining city on a hill." This is a clip.
GOV. MARIO CUOMO: Mr. President, you ought to know that this nation is more a "Tale of Two Cities" than it is just a "shining city on a hill." ... Maybe—maybe, Mr. President, if you stopped in at a shelter in Chicago and spoke to the homeless there; maybe, Mr. President, if you asked a woman who had been denied the help she needed to feed her children because you said you needed the money for a tax break for a millionaire or for a missile we couldn’t afford to use.
AMY GOODMAN: That was Governor Mario Cuomo giving his 1984 address at the Democratic National Convention. Juan, you attended his wake. I went to the end of the funeral. You wrote your column on him, and we’ll link to it, at the New York Daily News. But in a nutshell, what people were saying?
JUAN GONZÁLEZ: Well, you know, Cuomo was not only a silver-tongued orator and a philosopher, really, in many ways, as a government leader, he was also very much a friend of the working class and of the labor movement. And, of course, 25 years ago, I was fired as a columnist at the Daily News when 2,500 of us went out on strike against the Tribune Company, and we were all permanently replaced by the Tribune Company, but Mario Cuomo, to his credit, as governor, spoke at a rally, defended the striking Daily News workers, along with Cardinal O’Connor, and really turned the tide in the public sentiment to eventually allow us to be able to win that strike and for the Tribune Company to sell the paper to another owner. So he always wasn’t afraid to stand up and stand up for his principles, whether it was against the death penalty or in favor of a woman’s right to choose or to stand up for the striking workers at the Daily News. And so, I think that’s part of his legacy that has to be remembered—along with building more prisons than any governor in the history of the state.
AMY GOODMAN: Interestingly, I believe he appointed a special prosecutor in a very racially charged case, the Howard Beach case, in the death of Michael [Griffith]. Interestingly, his son, Governor Cuomo, had that opportunity in the case of Eric Garner but did not take it.
JUAN GONZÁLEZ: But did not do it, yes, and there are obviously marked differences between the father and the son, although they share a lot of the same combative approaches to government. But I think Cuomo was more of a statesman, I think, than his son is.
AMY GOODMAN: We’re going to turn right now—and, by the way, we will link to Juan’s column in the New York Daily News, but we’ve got to return to the top story of the day.
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At Least 12 Killed in Gun Attack on French Magazine that Printed Muhammad Cartoons
At least 12 people have been killed in a shooting attack on a French satirical magazine in Paris. Witnesses say masked gunmen entered the offices of the magazine, Charlie Hebdo, and opened fire. Charlie Hebdo has drawn multiple threats for its caricatures of the Prophet Muhammad. In 2012, the magazine’s cartoon depicting Muhammad in pornographic poses helped spark protests across the Middle East. The outcry forced France to close embassies and other official sites in 20 countries. Charlie Hebdo has repeatedly claimed it publishes the cartoons as a defender of free expression and against religious extremism. Speaking at the scene of the attack, French President François Hollande said barbaric people had carried out "an attack on free speech."
White House Promises Veto of GOP-Backed Keystone XL Bill
The new Republican-controlled Congress has begun with immediate salvos over the Keystone XL pipeline. On the first day of the 114th Congress, Republican Senator John Hoeven of North Dakota introduced a measure to approve construction of the project that would move Canadian tar sands oil to the Gulf Coast. But White House Press Secretary Josh Earnest immediately announced President Obama would veto the Keystone bill if it crosses his desk.
White House Press Secretary Josh Earnest: "I would not anticipate that the president will sign this piece of legislation. We promised — you know, we indicated that the president would veto similar legislation that was being considered by the previous Congress, and our position on this hasn’t changed. Again, there’s a well-established process that should not be undermined by legislation."
Even if the bill passes and Obama ends up using the veto, Republicans have vowed to make Keystone a top priority in their newfound control of Congress. Their next step could be to attach Keystone’s approval to a wider bill containing measures Obama supports. The White House says President Obama continues to await a State Department review and a Nebraska court ruling on the Keystone XL’s route.
Environmentalists: Obama Veto Threat on Keystone XL a Victory for Activism
In recent public comments, Obama has voiced increasing skepticism of the Keystone XL, questioning its benefit to most Americans as well as its impact on the climate. Environmentalists have praised Obama’s veto threat. In a statement, the Rainforest Action Network said, "This is a testament to the dedication and resolve of millions of grassroots activists who have for years fought to stop this pipeline, against all odds." The Center for Biological Diversity added, "It’s encouraging to see President Obama stand up to the bullies in Congress who want to ram this project through. ... [H]ere’s hoping this is his first step toward killing this project once and for all."
Boehner Defeats Internal GOP Challenge to Remain House Speaker
As Republicans caught their first glimpse of a showdown with President Obama in the new Congress, they were also locked in an internal struggle of their own. Just after lawmakers were sworn in, House Speaker John Boehner defeated an attempt from dissident Republicans to oust him from his post. Two dozen Republicans voted against Boehner’s speakership while one abstained, the highest number from a speaker’s own party in decades. Congressmembers Louie Gohmert of Texas and Ted Yoho of Florida led the challenge. In response to the failed ouster, Boehner retaliated by removing several lawmakers who opposed him from influential House committees.
McConnell Assumes Role of Senate Majority Leader
Meanwhile in the Senate, 34 senators were sworn in, 13 of them for the first time. Republican Senator Mitch McConnell assumed the job of Senate majority leader.
Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell: "Today is an important day for our country. Many senators took the oath this afternoon, 13 for the first time, and a new Republican majority accepted its new responsibility. We recognize the enormity of the task before us. We know a lot of hard work awaits. We know many important opportunities await, as well. I’m really optimistic about what we can accomplish."
House GOP Accused of "Voodoo Economics" with Rule Change on Tax, Budget Bills
In its first vote, the Republican-controlled House approved a major rule change that could make it easier for them to advance tax cuts for the wealthy. The passage of so-called "dynamic scoring" will force congressional statisticians to alter how they calculate the costs of major tax and budget bills. The Joint Committee on Taxation and the Congressional Budget Office will now have to weigh the anticipated revenue from potential economic growth that could result from legislation. Democrats have denounced the effort as "voodoo economics" that will hide the actual costs of tax cuts that Republicans want to pass.
Fmr. Virginia Gov. McDonnell Sentenced to 2-Year Prison Term in Corruption Case
In Virginia, former Republican Gov. Bob McDonnell has been sentenced to two years in prison following his conviction last year on corruption charges. McDonnell and his wife were found guilty of receiving more than $140,000 in exchange for promoting the donor’s products and providing other favors. McDonnell’s two-year prison sentence is far less than the minimum of 10 years recommended by the federal probation office. Speaking outside the courtroom, McDonnell said he regrets his actions — but then announced he would appeal.
Bob McDonnell: "As I said in court, I am a fallen human being. I’ve made mistakes in my life. I always tried to put the best interests of the people first as governor, but I have failed at times. And some of the judgments that I have made during the course of my governorship have hurt myself, my family and my beloved people of Virginia. And for that, I am deeply, deeply sorry. I also want to say that I disagree with the verdict that was rendered by the jury in this case, and that we intend to file our appeal to the United States 4th Circuit Court of Appeals either later today or in the morning."
McDonnell was initially offered a plea bargain, but opted instead to go to trial. His defense strategy largely entailed placing the blame on his wife Maureen, who as a nonpublic official could not have been convicted of corruption charges on her own. Maureen McDonnell will be sentenced next month. Bob McDonnell has been ordered to report to prison by February 9.
Gunman Kills Doctor, Takes Own Life at VA Clinic in Texas
A gunman has opened fire at a Veterans Affairs medical center in El Paso, Texas, killing a doctor before taking his own life. The shooting sparked an hour-long lockdown. No details about the gunman or the victim have been released so far.
FBI Probing Targeted Explosion at NAACP Office in Colorado
The FBI says it’s investigating a deliberate explosion outside the Colorado headquarters of the NAACP, one of the nation’s most prominent civil rights groups. An improvised explosive device was detonated on the NAACP building’s wall in Colorado Springs Tuesday morning. A gasoline can placed nearby did not ignite. No one was wounded in the attack. Authorities say they’re searching for a person of interest in the case, described as a male in his forties.
New York Transit Authority Bans "Die-Ins" at Grand Central
Transit authorities in New York City have banned "die-ins" at Grand Central Station after a month of daily protests. In a die-in, activists lie down on the ground as if they are dead. The protests have occurred every night at Grand Central since a grand jury chose not to indict a New York police officer for the killing of Eric Garner in a banned chokehold. The Metropolitan Transportation Authority says it will begin enforcing rules that bar people from lying on the ground inside Grand Central. The die-in protests continued on Tuesday with a vigil inside the terminal.
Suicide Attack Kills Dozens in Yemeni Capital
Around 40 people have been killed and dozens more wounded in a car bombing in Yemen’s capital of Sanaa. A suicide bomber driving a minibus apparently targeted a police academy filled with students and recruits. The attack appears to be the latest by al-Qaeda fighters against Houthi Shiite fighters.
Obama Pledges Support for Mexican Drug War in White House Meeting with Embattled Peña Nieto
President Obama hosted Mexican President Enrique Peña Nieto at the White House on Tuesday amidst a continued political crisis in Mexico over the disappearance of 43 students. Peña Nieto praised Obama’s recent executive action on immigration, while President Obama said he backed Mexico’s drug war.
President Obama: "Our commitment is to be a friend and supporter of Mexico in its efforts to eliminate the scourge of violence and the drug cartels that are responsible for so much tragedy inside of Mexico, and we want to be a good partner in that process, recognizing that ultimately it will be up to Mexico and its law enforcement to carry out the key decisions that need to be made."
Outside of the White House, a group of demonstrators gathered to call on the U.S. to cut funding to Mexico over its failure to investigate and prosecute abuses by state security forces.
Freed Cuban 5 Member, Wife Welcome Baby Girl Conceived During U.S. Imprisonment
And a Cuban intelligence agent freed by the U.S. last month and his wife have welcomed a baby girl who was conceived during his time in prison. Gerardo Hernández, the father, is one of the three former Cuban intelligence agents released as part of a prisoner swap amidst thawing ties with Cuba. While he was not allowed conjugal visits, Hernández was able to impregnate his wife, Adriana Pérez, by having his frozen sperm transferred to her in Panama. The process was authorized by U.S. officials, funded by the Cuban government and facilitated by a staffer for Vermont Senator Patrick Leahy. Some have called it the "diplomaculate conception." Gema Hernández Pérez was born on Tuesday.
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