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For the second time in six months, National Guard troops have been deployed in response to police brutality protests. Baltimore erupted in violence Monday night over the death of Freddie Gray, the 25-year-old African-American man who died of neck injuries suffered in police custody after he was arrested for running. Police say at least 27 people were arrested as cars and stores were set on fire, and at least 15 officers were injured. Baltimore public schools are closed, and a weeklong curfew is in effect from 10 p.m. to 5 a.m. Also Monday, thousands gathered to pay their respects during Freddie Gray’s funeral, including our guest, Rev. Jesse Jackson, civil rights leader, and president and founder of the Rainbow PUSH Coalition. Jackson says the violence "diverts attention away from the real issue" that West Baltimore is an "oasis of poverty and pain" where residents have long suffered from police abuse and economic neglect. We also speak with Lawrence Bell, former Baltimore City Council president. He grew up in and represented the impoverished area where Freddie Gray was arrested, and argues the "chickens are coming home to roost."
TRANSCRIPT
This is a rush transcript. Copy may not be in its final form.
AMY GOODMAN: We’re on the road in The Hague in The Netherlands, but we begin today’s show in Baltimore, Maryland, where National Guard troops have been deployed following violent protests over the death of Freddie Gray, the 25-year-old African-American man who died of neck injuries suffered in police custody after he was arrested for running. His family has said his spine was "80 percent severed" at the neck. Police say they arrested at least 27 people on Monday night. At least 15 police officers were injured during the uprising. Overnight, cars and stores were set on fire, including a CVS and a portion of an historic Italian deli that’s been in the city since 1908.
Following Ferguson, this marks the second time in six months the National Guard has been called to restore order after police brutality protests. This time, protests erupted in the West Baltimore neighborhood where Gray was first arrested for making eye contact with a lieutenant and then running away. On Monday night, Maryland Governor Hogan declared a state of emergency. Today, Baltimore’s public schools are closed, and a week-long curfew is in effect from 10:00 p.m. to 5:00 a.m. Baltimore Mayor Stephanie Rawlings-Blake addressed the city Monday night.
MAYOR STEPHANIE RAWLINGS-BLAKE: What we see tonight that is going on in our city is very disturbing. It is very clear there is a difference between what we saw over the past week with the peaceful protests, those who wish to seek justice, those who wish to be heard and want answers, and the difference between those protests and the thugs, who only want to incite violence and destroy our city.
AMY GOODMAN: Earlier on Monday, thousands gathered to pay their respects during Freddie Gray’s funeral, including Maryland Democratic Congressmember Elijah Cummings, a delegation from the White House, and the family of Eric Garner, the Staten Island man who died after a New York City police officer put him in a banned chokehold. This is Gray family attorney Billy Murphy.
WILLIAM MURPHY: You know, most of us are not here because we knew Freddie Gray, but we’re all here because we know lots of Freddie Grays. Let’s dont’ kid ourselves. We wouldn’t be here today if it wasn’t for video cameras. Instead of one cover-up behind that blue wall after another cover-up behind that blue wall, and one lie after another lie, now we see the truth as never before. It’s not a pretty picture.
AMY GOODMAN: Baltimore police say they expect to present a report on Gray’s death to the state’s attorney’s office by Friday, but officials have not said when the report will be made public. Six officers involved in Gray’s arrest have been suspended with pay.
Well, for more, we go to Baltimore, where we’re joined by two guests. The Reverend Jesse Jackson is with us, civil rights leader, president and founder of Rainbow PUSH Coalition. He spoke at Freddie Gray’s funeral Monday. And Lawrence Bell rejoins us, former Baltimore City Council president. He represented West Baltimore, which is the area where Freddie Gray was arrested.
We welcome you both back to Democracy Now! Reverend Jackson, let’s begin with you. Your reaction to what took place last night, as well as your message in the funeral of Freddie Gray?
REV. JESSE JACKSON: Well, what happened last night was very disturbing. It was a expression of hopelessness and self-destructive violence, which diverts attention away from the real issues. For example, Fred Gray was the 111th [inaudible] killed by a policeman since 2011—one-one-one, not just the first one. Secondly, in that same area, unemployment is 30 percent. There are 18,000 vacant homes or abandoned lots, because government—because banks ran subprime lending and predatory lending on people. The banks got bailed out; the people got left out. So the abounding poverty, because you have the most people in that area who have been to prison who come out and can’t vote and then can’t get the job because they’ve been to prison. So you have—you really have this oasis of poverty and pain, and you must, beside last night, address the structural crisis in Baltimore and urban America, period.
AMY GOODMAN: Lawrence Bell, the area that you represented when you were in the City Council is the area where Freddie Gray was arrested—arrested, again, according to the lieutenant, she made eye contact with him, and he ran away, and that was grounds for arresting him. Can you talk about this community where—that you have represented for so long?
LAWRENCE BELL: Well, in fact, I was actually born a few blocks away from where the incident occurred, so it really touches me personally. You know, I think that there have been years of neglect, not only of West Baltimore, but all over the inner city of Baltimore. And I think that the chickens are coming home to roost. I mean, this is a tale of two cities. This has been going on for a long time, not only the police abuse, which escalated in the early 2000s under the zero-tolerance policy of Martin O’Malley, but also just the economic violence that has been committed against a people. And you have a lot of young people, many of whom have already been arrested because of the mass arrests that have gone on in Baltimore City. They see no hope. They see no way out. And they’re acting out, unfortunately, and it says that we’ve got to wake up and do something.
REV. JESSE JACKSON: Amy, I think also, we were in church yesterday, where governor noticed that the gangs were coming together, and they want to shoot a police. Immediately there was a kind of panicky move to do a lockdown on the city. There were several schools, when the public transportation stopped, did not have a way home. You had thousands of kids on the streets with no way to get home, because when the city went to lockdown rather than a policeman get shot, transportation stopped, businesses closed, and kids had nowhere to go. In that environment, the whole thing exploded.
AMY GOODMAN: I want to go to Maryland Governor Larry Hogan. This is just after he announced the state of emergency and activated the National Guard to respond to unrest in Baltimore.
GOV. LARRY HOGAN: Everybody believes we need to get to the answers and resolve this situation, the concern everybody has about what exactly happened in the Freddie Gray incident. That’s one whole situation. This is an entirely different situation. This is lawless gangs of thugs roaming the streets, causing damage to property and injuring innocent people, and we’re not going to tolerate that.
AMY GOODMAN: "Lawless gangs of thugs," Reverend Jackson. Your response?
REV. JESSE JACKSON: Well, I think such language does not aid the situation. For example, those people, those bankers who engaged in subprime and predatory lending and took people’s homes and drove them out of the middle class into poverty, what is their name? Or 111 killings in three years in one area, what do you call those who did the killing, when there was no camera? When you look at 30 percent unemployment, TIF money spent downtown for the big new Baltimore, and pension money and banking money. So you have, as Brother Bell says, you have downtown blossoming, booming Baltimore, and then you have the rest of them. Now, we did not engage in name calling on that matter, but we do know that that strategy does not work. And we really need to look at, Amy, the Kerner Commission Report of 50 years ago. It says when you have this radical racial divide and economic divide, there must be some remedy, not just reaction.
AMY GOODMAN: Reverend Jackson, can you also respond to Freddie Gray’s arrest? This issue of—this is according to the police, that he made eye contact with the lieutenant and ran away, that’s what they allege. The attorney for the Fraternal Order of Police, the police union, said running in a high-crime area is grounds for arrest.
REV. JESSE JACKSON: Well, you know, it’s interesting enough that police here and firemen have the right to work in the city and live in the suburbs. Some live as far away as York, Pennsylvania. And so they come in as an occupying force, not as neighbors. So, often people are afraid of them, because they’re not taxpaying neighbors whose children go to school with their children. So there is this gap between police and people. And you really ought to have residential requirements for policemen and firemen. Those who get nectar from the flower should sow pollen where they pick up nectar.
AMY GOODMAN: Baltimore Orioles chief operating officer John Angelos, who is the son of the owner, Peter Angelos, took to Twitter this weekend to defend the Baltimore protests after they were attacked on local sports radio. He wrote, quote, "my greater source of personal concern, outrage and sympathy beyond this particular case is focused neither upon one night’s property damage nor upon the acts, but is focused rather upon the past four-decade period during which an American political elite have shipped middle class and working class jobs away from Baltimore and cities and towns around the U.S. to third-world dictatorships like China and others, plunged tens of millions of good, hard-working Americans into economic devastation, and then followed that action around the nation by diminishing every American’s civil rights protections in order to control an unfairly impoverished population living under an ever-declining standard of living and suffering at the butt end of an ever-more militarized and aggressive surveillance state." Again, so wrote Baltimore Orioles chief operating officer John Angelos, who is the son of the owner, Peter Angelos. Reverend Jackson?
REV. JESSE JACKSON: You can’t get any better than that, because you have this combination of guns in, drugs in, jobs out, and alienation between those who live in the surplus and those who live in the deficit. So there are some causal factors that must not be ignored. We regret that there was the expression of street violence last night, because, one reason, it’s not redemptive; two, it diverts attention from the agenda put on that letter. We should be discussing today the Kerner Report as opposed to what happened last night. But there is a cause-effect relationship. But we should do well not to panic in the face of last night, and move toward the remedies. Since this is so close to Washington, why not make this an urban model for reconstruction?
LAWRENCE BELL: Let me also add to what Reverend Jackson just said. You know, back in the 1930s, my grandfather came from North Carolina to Baltimore with very little education and got a good-paying job at Bethlehem Steel. Now, those—like the grandparents of many of those young people out there yesterday, those jobs have dried up. And this is a generation that—where there are too many people seeking too few jobs in Baltimore City. They are disadvantaged. And then, on top of that—and I do agree with the comments of Mr. Angelos—you know, people on the street in Sandtown, in Mondawmin, in West Baltimore, they know already what happened to Freddie Gray. And the thing that concerns us is that if so many people know what happened, they know the officer that was involved, they know how he was killed, if they know, why don’t the police know? Why doesn’t the mayor know? Why doesn’t—why isn’t that announced sooner? So it says something about the priorities in that area. And something really has to change soon.
REV. JESSE JACKSON: And this blue code of [inaudible], it means that police must—will not police other police. They know who engage in violence and excessive force. And because police will not tell on police—gangbangers will not tell on gangbangers, getting that model from adults. The corruption of the relationship between people and police, that corrupt relationship must end.
AMY GOODMAN: This is a clip from a video report by The Real News Network titled "A Walk Through the Neighborhood Where Freddie Gray Lived and Died," in which reporter Stephen Janis follows reporter and former prisoner Eddie Conway and our guest, Lawrence Bell, as they visit a rundown basketball court in the Gilmor Homes housing project, where Freddie Gray was arrested.
LAWRENCE BELL: I have a lot of interest in this community, and I’m saddened to see how things have gone downhill.
STEPHEN JANIS: This week, Bell joined The Real News correspondent Eddie Conway to talk about politics, crime and punishment, and what needs to happen to improve the city he loves.
LAWRENCE BELL: This city has been socially, economic and politically subdued and downtrodden so much in the last several years that people don’t even complain about it anymore. And they’re afraid to.
STEPHEN JANIS: The discussion took place against a symbolic backdrop for both men: a dilapidated basketball court in the Gilmor Homes housing project in West Baltimore, left in disrepair by the city for nearly 17 years. Conway has raised money to fix the court, but the city has blocked his efforts.
EDDIE CONWAY: So we’ve got a company that’s certified, that does this, that’s donating some of the stuff.
LAWRENCE BELL: OK.
EDDIE CONWAY: And they’re going to be in from the beginning to the end to make sure it’s done.
STEPHEN JANIS: The city told us the community was divided on whether they wanted the court rebuilt. But residents we spoke to said they supported fixing it.
GILMOR HOMES RESIDENT: Look at it. This court ain’t been up since I was about three. I ain’t seen these goals up—
EDDIE CONWAY: Yeah, yeah.
GILMOR HOMES RESIDENT: From my own visual eyes, I ain’t seen them up yet.
AMY GOODMAN: That report from The Real News Network. Lawrence Bell, if you would like to elaborate further, and also, can you talk about the calls for the autopsy report to be released, and what more you feel needs to be done?
LAWRENCE BELL: Well, you know, the great irony is that that walk that I did with Eddie Conway happened just a few days before the incident. You know, it’s amazing.
REV. JESSE JACKSON: Before?
LAWRENCE BELL: Right before that happened. We didn’t know that was going to happen. We happened to be there. And it just underscored what we were talking about. People are very upset. There is a lack of interest in just valuing the people that live in the neighborhood. And it’s been exacerbated by this situation, because we think information needs to come out a lot sooner. You know, people have seen these shows like 48 Hours, where they’re told that within the first two days or so, law enforcement should have an idea of what happened in a homicide. And here we see, nearly two weeks after this incident—everybody in that neighborhood and all the people in the street know. I’ve talked to people. I’ve talked to police officers. And as Reverend Jackson said earlier, one of the problems we have—and this is something here in Baltimore and all around the country that needs to be dealt with—is that even when we have African-American police and even well-intentioned white police officers, who see something that goes wrong, and they know somebody, as in this instance—and matter of fact, in this instance, the primary perpetrator was known to be racist. He was known to be negative in that neighborhood. Everybody knew it over in Western District, and he was still—he’s still been there. Now, when so many people know what’s going—
REV. JESSE JACKSON: Other incidents on tape.
LAWRENCE BELL: On tape. And there are people who saw it. They know where the paddy wagon stopped, when they took the young man out, they beat him up again. They have all these people who know this. Why has it taken two weeks to come out with a report, with an autopsy? If this had happened right after the incident, and someone was being fired immediately, OK, and people were let go, this would not have escalated to this point. So I think it’s a lesson for all of us here—
AMY GOODMAN: We just have 20 seconds.
LAWRENCE BELL: —and throughout the country.
REV. JESSE JACKSON: That’s what the man in Charleston, South Carolina, did.
AMY GOODMAN: We have 20 seconds. I want—
REV. JESSE JACKSON: He moved quickly.
AMY GOODMAN: I want to thank you both for being with us. Reverend Jesse Jackson spoke at Freddie Gray’s funeral yesterday, founder, president of PUSH now. And thank you so much to Lawrence Bell for being with us, former Baltimore City Council president, represented West Baltimore, which is the area where Freddie Gray was arrested.
This is Democracy Now! When we come back, the Nobel Prize winner Shirin Ebadi, the first Iranian to win the Nobel Peace Prize, weighs in on the Iran compromise. She’s one of the chief critics of the Iranian regime, but says that the Iranian nuclear deal should be supported. Stay with us.
We are broadcasting from The Hague, where we are speaking with the women Nobel Peace Prize laureates who have gathered to mark the 100th anniversary of the Women’s International League for Peace and Freedom. In an extended interview, we speak with 2003 Nobel Peace Prize winner Shirin Ebadi, the first Iranian and first Muslim woman to win the award for her human rights advocacy, in particular for the rights of Iranian women, children and political prisoners. She was the first female judge in Iran, but she has lived in exile since 2009. Ebadi discusses the threat posed by the self-proclaimed Islamic State, and the significance of the framework deal agreed to by Iran and world powers including the United States and Israel to curb its nuclear program for at least a decade. "I do not agree with any of the nuclear energy programs," Ebadi says. "Therefore, it has to stop as soon as possible. But at the same time, a country that does have an atomic bomb cannot judge in this manner about other countries."
TRANSCRIPT
This is a rush transcript. Copy may not be in its final form.
AMY GOODMAN: We’re continuing our broadcast from The Hague in The Netherlands, where we turn to Nobel Peace Prize winner Shirin Ebadi. In 2003, she became the first Iranian and first Muslim woman to win the award for her human rights advocacy, in particular for the rights of Iranian women, children and political prisoners. She was the first female judge in Iran, but she has lived in exile since 2009.
Shirin Ebadi is in The Hague this week for a conference marking the hundredth anniversary of the International Congress of Women, when over a thousand women traveled here to call for an end to World War I. The event marked the formation of the Women’s International League for Peace and Freedom, known as WILPF. Well, this week, WILPF has brought together a new generation of feminist peace activists at The Hague in the centennial celebration of their organization for a conference called Women Stop War. On Monday, Shirin Ebadi spoke at the opening session about the threat posed by the self-proclaimed Islamic State.
SHIRIN EBADI: [translated] We have to remember that ISIS is not simply a terrorist group. It’s an ideology. And an ideology cannot be fought with bombs. This wrong ideology can only be fought with a correct interpretation of religion. Had books been thrown at people, at the Taliban, instead of bombs, and had schools been built in Afghanistan—4,000 schools could have been built in memory of the 4,000 people who died on 9/11—at this time, we wouldn’t have had ISIS. Let’s not forget that the roots of the ISIS rest in the Taliban, so let’s not repeat the experience that was a loss.
I only have a very short time to speak, so I have a specific suggestion for the United Nations. I demand that the United Nations, through a convention, encourage all countries to reduce their military budgets by 10 percent and use it for the education and welfare of the people. And I want to ask the United States and the Western world to throw books at people. You will see that we will have a better world in the future.
AMY GOODMAN: The 2003 Nobel Peace laureate, Shirin Ebadi, speaking at the opening of the Women’s International League for Peace and Freedom Women Stop War centennial conference here at The Hague. On Sunday, I interviewed Shirin Ebadi at a gathering of Nobel Peace Prize winners, the women winners, at the Nobel Women’s Initiative. I began by asking Dr. Ebadi to talk about the significance of the framework deal agreed to by Iran and world powers to curb Iran’s nuclear program for at least a decade.
SHIRIN EBADI: [translated] I hope that the negotiations come to a conclusion, because the sanctions have made the people poorer, and there is a lot of economical pressure in Iran. Of course, the extremists on both sides, both Iran and America, do not agree with the agreement. Me, personally, do not approve of the nuclear program of the government, because it’s very expensive and also economically doesn’t respond to what we need. We could have spent much less money and invest in solar energy. In general, nuclear energy powers are not good for the environment of Iran. Iran is located on earthquake faults. And we are scared that something like Fukushima could happen in Iran. Therefore, our national interest is for this agreement to come to a conclusion, and we can benefit from the results.
AMY GOODMAN: The Israeli prime minister, Benjamin Netanyahu, says that this is a dream for Iran, but the deal is a nightmare for the rest of the world. Your reaction?
SHIRIN EBADI: [translated] As I said earlier, in general, I do not agree with any of the nuclear energy programs. Therefore, it has to stop as soon as possible. But at the same time, a country that does have an atomic bomb cannot judge in this manner about other countries.
AMY GOODMAN: Netanyahu says this will lead to a nuclear arms race in the Middle East.
SHIRIN EBADI: [translated] It can and it may result in a nuclear race. But who started it in the Middle East? Which country in the Middle East had the first bomb in the region? I think the answer to this question is easy.
AMY GOODMAN: Because of the pressure that’s being put on President Obama around the nuclear deal, he says that part of the deal will be a phased lifting of sanctions.
SHIRIN EBADI: [translated] Laws in America, also the type of the sanctions, do not provide that the sanctions be lifted at one time. It’s very natural that it has to be done in phases. However, it shouldn’t take a long time. Sanctions have resulted in people becoming poorer, of course. The economic policy of the government and the corruption that exists, and also the fact that the government is not transparent, hurts people as much as the sanctions. In reality, it’s not only sanctions that hurt the people, but also lack of transparency, corruption and the wrong economic programs of the government have made the people poor.
AMY GOODMAN: Dr. Ebadi, you can hardly be called an apologist for the Iranian government. You’re living in exile, for one thing. Your husband has been arrested by the government, your sister has been arrested—all this since you won the Nobel Peace Prize. What do you say to those who criticize the deal, saying that it will strengthen the Iranian government?
SHIRIN EBADI: [translated] I do criticize the government of Iran, but it is on the basis of violations of human rights and also the corruption that exists in the country, whereas when the United States criticizes the government of Iran, it is due to the fact that they are scared that the government of Iran becomes atomic and becomes closer. And there is a difference between my criticism of the government and the criticism of the United States. This means that those who criticize the government of Iran in America do not bring up the violations of human rights. It doesn’t look like it’s important for them. We see that they’re close friends of Saudi Arabia, which has the most violation of human rights in the Middle East.
AMY GOODMAN: What is your criticism of the Rouhani government? How does Rouhani compare to, well, his predecessor, Ahmadinejad?
SHIRIN EBADI: [translated] Rouhani smiles more than Ahmadinejad. That’s it. Because pursuant to the constitution, all the power belongs to the leader, and the president’s power is limited. This is why after Rouhani came to power, we haven’t seen any change. The situation of human rights has not gotten any better. If they’re talking to America now, it is because the leader has had to permit such negotiations.
AMY GOODMAN: What about the number of arrests, women’s rights in Iran, how women are able to express themselves under the Rouhani government?
SHIRIN EBADI: [translated] Unfortunately, the situation of women has not improved under Rouhani. At universities, have come to the solution of separating girls and boys. Musical concerts, women cannot play instruments any longer, something they could do in the past. Political prisoners are still in prison. Mr. Rouhani had promised that Mousavi and Karroubi, who have not been tried but who are under house arrest, would be released, but up to now he hasn’t been able to do that and doesn’t even speak about it.
AMY GOODMAN: Mousavi, Karroubi, both influential Iranian politicians, they ran against Ahmadinejad for president.
SHIRIN EBADI: [translated] Mousavi was a nominee in 2009. However, since he had disagreements with Khamenei, the leader, he’s been under house arrest. Rouhani promised that he would release him. But not only he has not released him, since the date that he has come to power, he hasn’t even talked about it publicly, and he hasn’t said anything about it.
AMY GOODMAN: Dr. Ebadi, I wanted to ask your opinion of Marzieh Afkham, the Foreign Ministry spokesperson. It’s believed she will become Iran’s first female ambassador since the 1979 Iranian Revolution.
SHIRIN EBADI: [translated] There is a proverb which says, with one flower, you don’t get spring. Comparing her to all of the women who have been made to sit at home, having a woman who is politically very close to the government does not change much. You know very well that pursuant to the statistics of the government, unemployment in Iran is three times as much among women than it is among men, whereas the number of the university students, if we look at it, proves that 60 percent are female. This means that women in Iran are better educated, but they’re unemployed. And in order to prove to the world that we respect women, they use one woman, for example, as an ambassador—which is a good thing to do, but it shouldn’t be limited to one person. It should be expanded.
AMY GOODMAN: We continue our interview with the 2003 Nobel Peace laureate, Shirin Ebadi, in 30 seconds.
[break]
AMY GOODMAN: This is Democracy Now!, democracynow.org, The War and Peace Report. We’re on the road in The Hague in The Netherlands, as we return to my interview with 2003 Nobel Peace laureate Shirin Ebadi.
AMY GOODMAN: Your assessment of ISIS, the self-proclaimed Islamic State, and its growth in power?
SHIRIN EBADI: [translated] ISIS is not only a terrorist group, it’s a wrong ideology. Using a wrong interpretation of Islam, they kill people, they rape women, they sell women. And in order to fight ISIS, a coalition of 40 countries, under the leadership of the U.S., has formed, which bombs these people a few times per day. But this is not going to work, because we cannot put an end to ideology using a bomb. It’s a wrong ideology, which can be fought with a correct ideology. Instead of bombs, books should be thrown at them.
AMY GOODMAN: Has President Obama asked your opinion on what should be done? And what would you advise him?
SHIRIN EBADI: [translated] I would tell him, instead of bombs, try to build schools, throw books at people, try to fight the corruption that exists in the region where they’re at. Then you will see that ISIS will gradually go away.
AMY GOODMAN: When were you last in Iran, Dr. Ebadi?
SHIRIN EBADI: [translated] Exactly on June 21st, 2009, I left Iran. I left a few hours prior to the presidential elections in Iran, the elections that resulted in the killing of people on the streets. And as a result, Mousavi and Karroubi were put under house arrest. And I couldn’t go back to Iran. And since I was not in Iran to be arrested, my husband and my sister were arrested. They were hoping that by keeping them as hostages, I would be silenced. But I wasn’t. Then the government decided to expropriate all of my property and auction them off. Unfortunately, a number of my colleagues are still in prison. But I’m glad to say that I did not even close down for an hour. And my friends in Iran continue their work.
AMY GOODMAN: When you say not close down even for an hour, your organization works for women and girls?
SHIRIN EBADI: [translated] Yes. Of course, prior to that, I used to do it publicly, but now I have gone underground, because I don’t want my colleagues to get into trouble.
AMY GOODMAN: And your husband and sister, where are they now?
SHIRIN EBADI: [translated] Of course, they were set free after a while, because the government found out that I would not become silenced anyway. Under the pressure of public opinion and international organizations, set them free, because they were really innocent. And they were not my colleagues at all. They each have their own business.
AMY GOODMAN: Have you seen them since 2009?
SHIRIN EBADI: [translated] I have seen my husband once and my sister once.
AMY GOODMAN: Could they leave the country if they wanted to?
SHIRIN EBADI: [translated] Each of them have been able to leave once.
AMY GOODMAN: So how does that affect you personally? You’ve seen your husband, what, only once in six years?
SHIRIN EBADI: [translated] Naturally, the life that I’m living is not a very comfortable life. But this is the price that we have to pay for freedom in Iran. I’m not the only one paying this price. My colleagues who are in prison are paying a higher price.
AMY GOODMAN: So, just to be clear, Dr. Ebadi, you’re a target of the Iranian government, yet when it comes to sanctions and the nuclear deal, you’re for lifting those sanctions, right?
SHIRIN EBADI: [translated] Yes, because if the negotiations do not come to a conclusion, then the sanctions will continue. And they may even get worse. And it may result in hurting the people more and more. All of my endeavors in life is for my people to live a better life.
AMY GOODMAN: Do you trust the Iranian government?
SHIRIN EBADI: [translated] Never.
AMY GOODMAN: Well, that’s exactly the reason opponents give for not supporting a deal with Iran.
SHIRIN EBADI: [translated] In the agreement, it has been provided that if the government of Iran breaches the agreement, they can return the embargoes and the sanctions easily.
AMY GOODMAN: So I’ve asked you to share your advice you’d give to President Obama, what you’d say to opponents of a nuclear deal with Iran. What about what you say to peace activists around the world?
SHIRIN EBADI: [translated] Peace activists should, in reality, work for justice. And also, they should work on holding governments responsible. For example, when we look at like the Middle East region, we see that it is on fire. Why? Because a bunch of dictators have been there for numerous years. They violate human rights. They were corrupt. They didn’t let the civil society grow. And people became poorer every day. And unfortunately, the world closed its eyes on them. One day, people became tired and threw or deposed the dictators. But the civil society has not been formed. There is anarchy, and resulted in the whole region being on fire now. And unfortunately, people have two bad options. They either have to put up with a dictator or anarchy and insecurity. They’re both bad. We shouldn’t let it get to this point. The people have two bad options. Look at Syria. The Assad family has ruled there over 40 years. The situation is such that some people think that if Assad leaves, ISIS will take over. And so, people don’t know whether to choose between ISIS or Assad, who has killed all these people. Therefore, when I talk to peace activists, what I say is, don’t let countries get to this stage where they’re on fire and then try to put the fire out. We shouldn’t let fire to grow. We have to come to a conclusion to provide for the infrastructure. In medicine, we say it’s better to prevent than to treat. The same thing is true about peace. Let’s stop it. Let’s prevent it.
AMY GOODMAN: We’re living in very violent times. The U.S. is involved in the longest war in its history, in Afghanistan. Then you’ve got the wars in Iraq, in Syria, in Yemen, in Libya. Can you share your advice to the world, as a Nobel Peace laureate, as a woman?
SHIRIN EBADI: [translated] My advice is to want what they want for their own people for the people of these countries, as well. These countries have been destructed, obliterated, because big corporations want to become wealthier, so that they can sell arms. Therefore, my advice is: Treat the people of Afghanistan the same as you treat your own people. Look at Iraqi children the same as you look at your own children. Then you will see that the solution is there.
AMY GOODMAN: Dr. Shirin Ebadi, thank you very much for joining us.
SHIRIN EBADI: Thank you.
AMY GOODMAN: Iranian human rights attorney Shirin Ebadi. She won the Nobel Peace Prize in 2003, becoming the first Iranian and first Muslim woman to win the Nobel Peace Prize. Shirin Ebadi is in The Hague this week at the Women’s International League for Peace and Freedom centennial conference and the Nobel Women’s Initiative. You can visit our website to see yesterday’s interview with three other Nobel Peace laureates, Leymah Gbowee, Jody Williams and Mairead Maguire.
Headlines:
Baltimore: National Guard Deployed amid Uprising over Freddie Gray’s Death
Maryland Governor Larry Hogan has deployed the National Guard in Baltimore amid an uprising over the death of Freddie Gray. Gray died a week after a police encounter which his family said left his spine "80 percent severed" at the neck. Police stopped him because he made eye contact with a lieutenant, then ran away. Two weeks of peaceful protest over Gray’s death erupted into violence Monday as high school students threw bricks and rocks at police, and looting and vandalism were reported across the city. Overnight, cars and buildings were burned. Police said 15 officers were injured, though all are expected to recover. At least 27 people were arrested. Governor Hogan denounced the protesters as "gangs of thugs roaming the streets."
Governor Larry Hogan: "Everybody believes we need to get to the answers and resolve this situation, the concern everybody has about what exactly happened in the Freddie Gray incident. That’s one whole situation. This is an entirely different situation. This is lawless gangs of thugs roaming the streets, causing damage to property and injuring innocent people, and we’re not going to tolerate that."
Following Ferguson, this marks the second time in six months the National Guard has been called to restore order after protests over police violence.
Thousands Attend Funeral for Freddie Gray
The protests came after Freddie Gray’s funeral was attended by thousands, including Maryland Democratic Congressmember Elijah Cummings; a delegation from the White House; and the family of Eric Garner, the Staten Island man who died after a New York City police officer put him in a banned chokehold. Billy Murphy, an attorney for Freddie Gray’s family, addressed the mourners.
Billy Murphy: "You know, most of us are not here because we knew Freddie Gray, but we’re all here because we know lots of Freddie Grays."
Rev. Jesse Jackson also addressed mourners. We’ll speak to him in Baltimore after headlines.
Loretta Lynch Sworn in as 1st Black Woman Attorney General
Not far from the upheaval in Baltimore, Loretta Lynch was sworn in as the nation’s first African-American woman attorney general at a ceremony in Washington, D.C.
Loretta Lynch: "If a little girl from North Carolina, who used to tell her grandfather in the fields to lift her up on the back of his mule so she could see way up high, granddaddy, can grow up to become the chief law enforcement officer of the United States of America, we can do anything."
Lynch released a statement on the situation in Baltimore, vowing to "bring the full resources of the Department of Justice to bear in protecting those under threat, investigating wrongdoing, and securing an end to violence." The Justice Department is investigating Freddie Gray’s death.
Nepal’s Prime Minister Warns Quake Toll Could Reach 10,000
The prime minister of Nepal has warned the death toll from Saturday’s devastating 7.8-magnitude earthquake could reach 10,000. The toll now stands at over 4,300 and is continuing to climb, with 8,000 injured. While humanitarian aid has begun to reach the capital Kathmandu, residents of remote villages remain cut off by landslides, as they struggle to bury their dead. Entire villages have been flattened. Nepal has attempted to airdrop supplies, while residents complain of a dire need for food and water. UNICEF spokesperson Christophe Boulierac said up to one million children require urgent aid.
Christophe Boulierac: "So far, we think that nearly one million children are affected by the earthquake and are in need of emergency assistance. Usually in these situations, such as in Haiti in 2010, there are lots of surgery which is required for children who are maimed, who lost a part of one leg or an arm. So these are really pathologies typical that we find during situations of earthquake that needs urgent surgery."
Nigeria: Hundreds of Boko Haram Victims Found Dead
In Nigeria, hundreds of bodies have been found in the northeastern town of Damasak, after an apparent massacre by the militant group Boko Haram. Local sources told Agence France-Presse the death toll exceeds 400, with bodies found in homes, streets and a dried-up river. Troops from Chad and Niger retook the town from Boko Haram last month, discovering another mass grave containing about 100 bodies.
Libya: 5 Journalists Killed by ISIL
In Libya, five journalists with a Libyan TV station have been found dead with their throats slit eight months after they went missing. An army commander told Reuters the journalists were killed by militants with the self-proclaimed Islamic State.
Report: Israel Directly Attacked U.N. Sites in Gaza, Killing 44
A United Nations probe has confirmed Israeli forces conducted direct attacks on United Nations facilities in Gaza, killing at least 44 Palestinians sheltering at the sites during last summer’s assault. The attacks took place despite repeated notifications with the GPS coordinates of U.N. sites to Israeli forces. In one case, the Israeli Defense Forces fired 88 mortar rounds at a U.N. girls’ school where 3,000 refugees were sleeping, killing up to 18 people, including a U.N. employee and two of his sons. The probe also found Palestinian militants hid weapons at three empty U.N. schools. Palestinians have vowed to bring the findings to the International Criminal Court at The Hague, where they became the newest member earlier this month.
Supreme Court Hears Historic Same-Sex Marriage Case
The Supreme Court is hearing arguments today in a historic case that could legalize same-sex marriage across the United States. Same-sex couples can now wed in 36 states and Washington, D.C. But the case under consideration today could establish the constitutional right to marriage equality in all 50 states. The plaintiff in the case, Jim Obergefell, married his longtime partner John Arthur in Maryland when Arthur was dying of ALS. Their home state of Ohio has refused to recognize their marriage on Arthur’s death certificate, a right Obergefell said is worth fighting for.
Jim Obergefell: "The state of Ohio wants nothing more than to take John’s last official record as a person and to change it so that it’s wrong. They want to erase the fact that John and I were legally married. They want to erase the official record of our marriage, of me as John’s spouse. There’s no way I would ever stop fighting for that."
Oklahoma: Undersheriff Quits After Leak of Memo on Reserve Deputy Who Killed Eric Harris
In Oklahoma, the undersheriff of Tulsa County has resigned after a leaked report showed he intimidated staff to protect a reserve deputy and wealthy donor who killed an unarmed African-American man earlier this month. The deputy, Robert Bates, claimed he mistook his gun for a Taser when he fatally shot Eric Harris. An internal report from 2009 reveals how Bates was permitted to flout policies, patrolling in his own vehicle and conducting traffic stops on his own without adequate training. It found Undersheriff Tim Albin instructed staff to overlook Bates’ violations, telling a sergeant to "stop messing with [Bates] because he does a lot of good for the county." Sheriff’s officials initially claimed they couldn’t find any record of the 2009 probe, but a lawyer for Eric Harris’ family obtained a leaked copy. A judge allowed Robert Bates to go on a month-long vacation to the Bahamas after he pleaded not guilty to second-degree manslaughter in the death of Eric Harris.
South Carolina: 2 Cops Sentenced to Prison for Tasering Disabled Woman
In South Carolina, two police officers in the city of Marion have been sentenced to prison for unnecessarily shocking a disabled woman with a Taser at least eight times in 2013. Franklin Brown, who shocked the victim, Melissa Davis, while she was handcuffed and not resisting, received an 18-month term, while fellow officer Eric Walters was sentenced to a year. Brown admitted telling fellow officers he shocked Davis because he "did not want to touch that nasty [expletive]."
Report: Goldman Sachs Paid Bill Clinton $200,000 for Speech, Then Lobbied Hillary Clinton
A new report by the International Business Times has revealed Goldman Sachs paid former President Bill Clinton $200,000 to deliver a speech, just months before the banking giant began lobbying the State Department, which was then led by Hillary Clinton. The report by David Sirota and Andrew Perez is the latest to raise questions about the Clintons’ financial ties. On Sunday, the Clinton Foundation acknowledged mistakes in how it reported donations from foreign governments, saying it "mistakenly combined" the sums with other donations, and would refile tax returns.
Judge Upholds Vermont GMO Labeling Law; Chipotle Eliminates GMOs
And a federal judge has rejected a bid by the food industry to strike down a Vermont law which would make the state the first in the country to require labeling of genetically modified foods. The judge rejected a request by industry groups to block the law, but let the groups’ lawsuit move forward, paving the way for a trial over the law. Meanwhile, the fast-food company Chipotle says it has become the first national restaurant chain to eliminate GMO foods.
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